Thursday, September 01, 2005

re: Christist yoga

sept 1

time ran a 16-page cover story on yoga in 2004 without mentioning the words 'india' or 'hindu' even once.

here we have christists using microsoft tactics as usual: 'embrace, extend, exterminate'.

this is exactly how the christist west appropriated a lot of things like greek, roman, druidic, buddhist, indic ideas: much as the susan caldwells and courtrights and clooneys do under our very noses today.

and that somewhat biased mexican nobel-prize winner octavio paz compared hinduism to a metaphysical boa constrictor. what would christism be then? a python, that swallows other cultures wholesale without a trace?

the west gets all upset about the chinese appropriating *their* intellectual property. what about the west happily expropriating *our* intellectual property?

the back-royalties from the indian numbering system alone would pay off india's national debt many times over. we should be making noise about and perhaps taking show-cases to the WIPO for royalties for calculus, various areas of astronomy, medicine, etc. enough of wholesale theft of ideas!

the theft continues today: it's increasingly bio-diversity theft these days; as they come in and steal genetic strains.

i think india should completely ignore western patenting mechanisms. it has not been shown that patents are of any use to anybody other than monopoly profiteers. the data is ambivalent about whether patenting encourages innovation. the pharma process patent idea that india had was a good one: and we should find other ways of weasel-wording and sliming our way out of WIPO and TRIPS treaty obligations.

ps. moment of black humor: i find myself in agreement with ratzinger for perhaps the first and only time ever: we concur that yoga has nothing to do with christism, whatsoever.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Srinivasan Kalyanaraman <kalyan97@gmail.com>
Date: Aug 31, 2005 6:06 PM
Subject: Christist yoga
To: "Srinivasan Kalyanaraman (GMail)" <kalyan97@gmail.com>

Time Magazine, Monday, Aug. 29, 2005
Stretching for Jesus
Christian yoga is gaining a devout following--upsetting purists,
Hindus and some Christians
By LISA TAKEUCHI CULLEN/MAHTOMEDI

The yoga teacher sits in a lotus position atop a polished wooden
platform. Behind her, verdant woods are visible through panoramic
windows. Gentle music tinkles from overhead speakers. Two dozen
students in spandex outfits, most of them women, settle onto purple
and blue mats to begin the class with ujjayi, a breathing exercise.
Their instructor, Cindy Senarighi, recommends today's mantra.
"'Yahweh' is a great breath prayer," she says. "The Jesus Prayer also
works. Now lift your arms in praise to the Lord."

The platform is an altar, the tinkly tune is praise music, and the
practice is Christian yoga. Senarighi's class, called Yogadevotion and
taught in the main chapel of St. Andrew's Lutheran Church in
Mahtomedi, Minn., is part of a fast-growing movement that seeks to
retool the 5,000-year-old practice of yoga to fit Christ's teachings.

...

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1098937,00.html

26 comments:

Anonymous said...

Rajeev, Hinduism is mentioned, but as a comment from some professor. Time itself has not inroduced Yoga as anything to do with hinduism. It will introduce hinduism when they discuss caste, race, rights, poverty etc...

Anonymous said...

Rajeev, This is not new. 'Margom' kali , a dance form of Syrian chritians is plagiarized from our Thiruvathira-kali.

Nowadays even 'ezhuthiniruthu' (first letters by a guru ) is conducted at Churches by a priest on Pooja day! When they cannot generate popular creative art-forms (other than land/temple loot), isnt it better to plagiarize and market it to fool the naive souls. Jeevan TV (a jesuit channel) telecasts bharathnatyam, mohiniyaatam with a lamp having a cross (not the usual 'nilavilakku' with the bird). Mischivous , criminal souls!

Shankar

Anonymous said...

it is hilarous to see this fretting about christian yoga.
how about paying royalties to the orginal speakers of the English language (by all the English speaking indians)?
Indian civilization had the greatness to invent a word for and Atom . but today the same indians dont have a word for 'computer'( in any native language)
Indians boast of the first algorithm (but not boast of the non-existence of a word to describe it in any native language).
and all the while we are trying literal translation of words from the English dictionary.
it is a pity and what we are doing is fret about Americans borrowing Indian yoga.
conservative thought and prgressive thought dont meet. militant islam is the result of the non-existence of progressive thought in islam, as everything is absolute. it is the same thing as conservatives pushing for teaching creationism in the public schools in the US. trying to push out prgressive thought.history is witness that progressive thought is the best for human race.and right wing fretting is nothing but hilarious

Randhir said...

how about paying royalties to the orginal speakers of the English language (by all the English speaking indians)?
Sure why not, provided 'English' folks can pay royalties for funding their 'industrial revolution' with our wealth and slave labor from India.
Remember that entire Manhatta was bought for $24 or so from the native Americans by those Dutch, don't forget to factor-in 200 years worth of compound interest and inflation adjustments.

indians dont have a word for 'computer'
The word 'vimana' has existed for over thousand years before Wright Brothers and Kitty Hawk.. what's you point? Collect royalties from Boeing and Airbus?

How about royalties for use of zero? Surely it's undisputed as to where the concept of zero came from.

conservative thought and prgressive thought dont meet.
Not necessarily. It's perfectly possible to be progressive in exploring new arenas such in arts, crafts and sciences while being conservative with respect to personal issues such as religion/culture/faith.

Anonymous said...

Dear progressive anon,

Are we discussing art forms/rituals or laguages,words? Do not divert as our fanatic Biju mathews, prasads

-BTW Is there a non-sanskrit word for 'YOGA'?
-No 'conservative' here is fretting for a 'hindu' computer or 'hindu' software for their developments but only evil missionaries do so. grow up and truly progress
-your quote"militant islam is the result of the non-existence of progressive thought in islam, as everything is absolute. it is the same thing as conservatives pushing for teaching creationism in the public schools in the US

militant islam and 'conservatives'!! y not militant islam and Christian terrorists? so are you the old 'george'?
- I think, it's for convenience , we r using the words like 'computer'. But any language would have a translation for 'computing machine'. multiple words may be required. so dont worry, dear progressive.

Did we ever get the due credit for the number system? Advanced mathematics? Now yoga? Now the 'myth' making looters (eg St Thomas, mylapore siva temple) have lot of 'work' to 'cook-up' stories on the different yoga positions 'used' by none other than their gawd!

Be a progressive rather than a stupid
Thanks
Shankar

Sameer said...

Hi Rajeev,

With reference to Shankar's comments, Id like to add a few more things...
I saw many christians refer to their churches or thatchs as 'Devalaya', they name their Mary as Amma or maatha... How horrendous! I saw a poster beside a Tamil church about some idiotic preacher, and you know what the fellow was called????? 'Sadhu James' Ha Ha...
I was also horrified when a bible was brought out in Sanskrit and they made Kuchipudi dance in christian form.
Yes, this is right, they outrightly hijack our culture and festivals...
Coming to festivals... since our Hindus go to temples and pilgrimage, those converted dont have anywhere to go (Can u imagine they going to Rome or Israel?) (Ofcourse there are some demands emerging for a Christian version of Haj subsidy, which no doubt will be looted from Hindus and Temples.
Coming to pilgrimage, these fellows come up with their own local 'pilgrim' spots (As if their Gods came here or were based on this land). Some of such piligrim things are like 'Our Lady of faith shrine' and some at Vellankani and some idiotic things at goa and Chennai. I feel like laughing at them when they cant come out of Hindu mindset after converting. Hey another funny thing, these converts remove their footwear when entering a church (which americans and europeans never do!) and some also break coconuts outside their churches... ha ha ha
Many such funny incidents.... they even name their things using sanskrit things like Hindus do... (I believe they have islamised themselves in Pakistan... for example their names there are same as muslim names except for their last name which is usually 'masih' for most of them... ex. Rehmat Masih, they read bible in urdu etc. Ofcourse there they get kicked if they try to act smart unlike in India where 'secular'=scoundrel netas are ever ready to lick their bottoms)

infww said...

Dividing the world into exactly two camps is a sign of mental inferiority on the part of the loser.

It is the most idiotic concept one can think of - that the whole world is divided into two camps, both defined and led by white-skinned people. One camp must support Xian fundamentalists and the other must support Communists because these two systems have been invented by white-skinned people. In addition, low IQ 'progressives' also support Islamofascists.

Indians who support either conservatives or "progressives" have the lowest IQ of them all - according to these inferiority ridden people who are so inferior that they cannot think, all Indians MUST follow the White way of life and be indebted to them. The level of inferiority is so much that they now insist that they want to pay royalties for speaking English.

san said...

What's more noteworthy -- Christians taking up Yoga, or Hindus graduating in Islamic Studies?

http://us.rediff.com/news/2005/sep/01pak2.htm

As per the article, a Hindu has become Chief Justice of Pakistan's Courts. I wonder how much power such a Chief Justice has with the parallel Islamic Courts exerting their divine power?

Anonymous said...

We should also get subsidies for trips to Hindu temples outside India. Probably the temples in Fiji, Thailand, US (LA, Pittsburgh,Hawaii), etc. If those guys can get a free trip then so should we.
(Thanks to Sameer for the idea.)

Anonymous said...

'Kanini' is a Tamil word for Computer.
We are not fretting about anybody doing yoga but fretting about the motive behind ignoring India or Hindu that too in a 16 page article about YOGA.

Anonymous Abraham said...

Sure why not, provided 'English' folks can pay royalties for funding their 'industrial revolution' with our wealth and slave labor from India
You have some evidence to back this up other than musings by pseudo-historians?
it is the same thing as conservatives pushing for teaching creationism in the public schools in the US
Not "conservatives", "fundamentalists" like yourself. After all, the "conservatives" in India would like to teach "Vedic Mathematics" and "Astrology".

Don't you think it is great that they are assimilating the "culture" of India? Or are you and the Shadow Warrior so upset that there would be no evidence to prove that the Indian Christians haven't assimilated into the Indian culture?

BTW, Mary the mother of Jesus is revered world over as Mother Mary, which, of course, is Mary Matha.....And exactly what "intellectual property" is being exploited by the West when they acquire certain plants for "genetic strains"? Is the Shadow Warrior prepared to pay royalties for potato and tomato both "stolen" from Peru and Mexico?

(Since most of you are in programming...)And one can live without zeros:

When I started programming, we didn't have any of these sissy 'icons'and 'Windows.' All we had were zeros and ones--and sometimes we didn't even have ones. I wrote an entire database program using only zeros.

You had zeros? We had to use the letter "O". - Dilbert

other said...

it is really depressing to hear that times ran a 16 page article on yoga without mentioning india or hindu. goes to show how polarised the world is becoming based on religious dogmas.

surya said...

Mr. Anon...
"Not "conservatives", "fundamentalists" like yourself. After all, the "conservatives" in India would like to teach "Vedic Mathematics" and "Astrology".

Then why are the many Coaching Institutes of IIM CAT are teaching vEdic Maths to their students....r they also "conservatives"???

Threre is this Bible Society of India near M G Road in Bangalore. If you read the name that is written in Kannada ...it goes like this " Satya vEda sangha "...hilarious isnt it?

If the bible is satya vEda....then wat r the others?? isnt it a derogatory term??

Aint no bleeding heart said...

"it is hilarous to see this fretting about christian yoga.
how about paying royalties to the orginal speakers of the English language (by all the English speaking indians)?"

wrong analogy mr. bleeding heart, liberal, progressive, leftist, secular, humanist illogical anonymous! a corect analogy would be if the english speaking indians would start to slowly disassociate English from its British roots, try to replace Shakespeare with an Indian poet as the greatest literary figure in English"

Anonymous said...

Hey, whats the fuzz all about?

I opened the url and found many references to Hindu and Hinduism in the first page itself. Say, statements like "Yoga is Hinduism" and "Yoga cannot be separated from its Hindu roots".

Are people criticizing without even doing a "Ctrl-F" search on the page? Pathetic!

Aint no bleeding heart said...

"I opened the url and found many references to Hindu and Hinduism in the first page itself. Say, statements like "Yoga is Hinduism" and "Yoga cannot be separated from its Hindu roots".

Are people criticizing without even doing a "Ctrl-F" search on the page? Pathetic!"


Before jumping off to conclusions you should do a "Ctrl-F" search on the blog itself.

FYI - The link posted refers to the current issue of Time. Rajeev's opening sentence refers to a 16-page cover story on yoga in 2004 without mentioning the words 'india' or 'hindu' even once.

Anonymous Abraham said...

A full critique of Vedic Mathematics can be found by searching the web - essentially it is a system to calculate quickly and bears a close resemblance to the Trachtenberg speed system. Also, the original book clearly states that there are more sutras that can be translated to provide additional "theorems". But since 1965 no new sutras have been translated or "theorems" based on this obscure text, published. Why not?

Coaching institutes to IIM are thus providing some method to calculate - after all in CAT you are not graded on how you arrived at the answer. Note that they are not taught in IIMs. Besides UC Berkeley (bastion of liberalism) and other universities have taught "intelligent design" as part of their course - are they "conservative"?

How is calling the Bible "Sathya Veda" derogatory? What about guys/girls that are named "Sathya" ?

S said...

Anonymous Abraham :- It is true that you found a 'critique' of vedic mathematics. Further it is also like some XYZ speed system. But in the context, you should ask the reverse - Have you ever found a complete appreciation of Vedic Mathematics ? [I wouln't fault you on this because of literature on the subject, but know that more exists]. the critique and and closeness to a system will be the future of this this little antique.

How is calling the Bible "Sathya Veda" derogatory WHo cares about derogatory or not, unless they use it to cheat unsuspecting hindus to conversion, by implying bluntly about the false gods

Randhir said...

Anonymous Abraham said...
Sure why not, provided 'English' folks can pay royalties for funding their 'industrial revolution' with our wealth and slave labor from India
You have some evidence to back this up other than musings by pseudo-historians?


You could visit your local library or google around to read books/works of renowned authors including Gandhi, Dadabhai Naoroji, Tilak etc.. please don't expect me to do your legwork. Or let's just say those benevolent Brits were in India as they liked our curry and weather and leave it at that.

Anonymous said...

The Perils Of Syncretism

Anonymous Abraham said...

How is calling the Bible "Sathya Veda" derogatory WHo cares about derogatory or not

This was in response to an earlier comment that stated calling the Holy Bible, "Sathya Veda" is derogatory to the Hindu Vedas. Yes I appreciate "Vedic Mathematics" just like I appreciate "XYZ system".

You could visit your local library or google around to read books/works of renowned authors including Gandhi, Dadabhai Naoroji, Tilak etc.. please don't expect me to do your legwork

Spoken like a true pseudo-historian who cannot provide an iota of "proof" to back his claim that "Indian slave labor contributed to the British Industrial Revolution". The very idea that one should be "compensated" for a "wrong" that occurred hundreds of years ago is just idiotic. Work and earn rather than sitting on your butt thinking of idiotic schemes like this to earn a living.

From the "perils of syncretism":

The spectacular, vip-pulling Swaminarayan temple was a prominent member of the NCHT along with the Hare Krishna temple in Watford, north of London. Called the Bhaktivedanta Manor, it was donated to the Hare Krishna movement by ex-Beatle George Harrison.

Hmmm sounds to me like Hindus trying to call their "thatch" a "Manor" to "assimilate" in UK.

Anonymous said...

So anony abe,

Spoken like a true pseudo-historian who cannot provide an iota of "proof" to back his claim that "Indian slave labor contributed to the British Industrial Revolution".
LOL.. you need the proof... and I've listed sources. Maybe Mahatma Gandhi was a pseudo-historian too for you. Can't help you there buddy.

Smriti said...

Would someone, anyone please read to this Annoying Abe the "Drain of Wealth" written by Dadabhai Naoroji.

Anonymous said...

One more funny thing. In Gujarat, they started Christian Garba (form of Raas-Garba, a dance performed for Mata Amba). who will stop this hypocrates?

Anonymous said...

While Bible pushers call it "Satya Veda", I have seen stickers in some bicycle repair store calling Quran
"The Last Testament" !!

Now recently at work, they are pushing
a new onsite Yoga program from some lady
who calls it "Icthus Yoga"!
Hmmm..http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=Ichthus

Swami Jnaneshvara Bharati (Swamiji, Swami J) said...

Would one say that people drinking wine are necessarily practicing the Christian rite of communion? Would one say that people eating bread with a meal are practicing the Christian rite of communion? Of course not.

If one does physical postures outside of its context as a 100% spiritual practice, you cannot call it Yoga, any more than you can call merely drinking wine and eating bread Christian communion.

Here is a brief video entitled
"Can a Christian Practice Yoga?"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQXAYioSQ9I