April 28th
this is an important event, as there is the possibility of something substantive coming out of it. of course, india's pathetic media which was so enamored of the political theater (nothing but show) coming out of the chinese and pakistani dictators' visits, is totally downplaying prime minister junichiro koizumi's visit. naturally, because this may actually get india some benefits.
in particular, as japan is fuming about china's state-orchestrated violence against japanese interests in china, as well as china's outright blocking of japan's security council seat, despite japan having given them over $10 billion in aid over time.
this means india looks a lot more attractive to japan at this time. it's time for a japan-vietnam-taiwan-india axis to contain the sino-islamic axis already in place.
but of course, the anti-national people in the english language media are only worried about china's interests, or saudi arabia's, or the vatican's, or america's. nobody is bothered about india's.
i am deliberately changing the date on this post to april 28th, the date of koizumi's visit.
65 comments:
Before start of 2nd world war many indian shopkeepes had opend up establishment in japan, during this period japanees killed all of them . not single surviver returned to tell story.
nice point!!
but do u think our "invertebrates" govt and policy/candle holders will ever take a step that will help our nation??
hmm..
the idea of tieup with jap/taiwan/viet is enticing!! add tibet to that!! or is it too late??
Definitely japan too has a very cruel geopolitical history of invading and holding most of east china repeatedly, during last 800 years, right from the imperial dynasticism in japan around 1400-1600, the ninja schools expanding into china, as well as military invasions. Japan also has cruelty proven about their handling of korea.
But seeing their complete change of attitude after 1945 HIROSHIMA and NAGASAKI destruction, currently I can say Japan is definitely a MORE RELIABLE alliance than CHINA. Also, JAPAN has less chance in geomilitary terms to possibly rule india, so it is possible that they WILL NOT DREAM OF RULING/DOMINATING INDIA. But CHINA WILL ALWAYS DREAM THAT, because they fear india becoming superpower inspite of terror problems, indian culture being really pragmatic.
The article is an excellent representation of the current +ve side of indo japanese possible tie up. But surprisingly, few days back, Rediff also posted an article that very aggressively justified the benefit of indo-chinese alliance against usa.
Remember that all such wild, paradoxical and ironical alliances cannot exist at a time in reality. So in terms of MFP (Most favored partner), India has to make a choice: EITHER JAPAN OR CHINA., while not totally cutting off the other nation.
Thats really a nice article. To be very frank, i am more inclined towards having better relationship with Japan than with China. At least, there is a hell lot of improvement to be done now. The bilateral trade figures between the two countries is too low compared to China. I sometimes wonder, Russia and Japan should have been given more importance than China.
Frankly, I can't trust Chinesse. Lets see what comes out from this visit.
Another wonderful piece of analysis from Rajeev. But I wonder if mandarins(pun intended) sitting in South block are capable enough to reason this. As of chinese, well having lived with them for past two years I can say that one just can't trust them. So this trade partnerships and all the hoophala is baseless. Are we going to another '62 ( although in different shade)? China is arming Pakis and Bangladeshis and will use them to irritate India. Border tension in Tripura is a minor manifestation of chinese policy in South Asia.
In India they are many seems to buy the china threat thoery and resort to china bashing all the time going back to history china is definitely a better country the the past western power.
Great post!! Really puts things in the proper perspective. The chinks are hypocrites. comrade mao killed millions of his own countrymen during the 'cultural revolution' but all that is just forgotten.
We need to stand up to the chi-communists and tell their bosom buddies here(CPM et al) to shut the hell up.
Good article. One has to look at the big picture before commenting on any alliance. Today's Africa could be tomorrow's China. Today's Japan could be tomorrow's Europe. India has to look at her interest in mind, her true long-term interest and nothing else. Shortsighted policies based on current geopolitical or economic considerations would not work for India's long-term success. We should be friendly with Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, Vietnamese, Americans, and Europeans at the same time.
Thank you.
Rajiv, yet again striking the target
very well. Iam very impressed by your
articles and this one also fares well.
We had been subjected to too many
humiliations from china, but still
we don't like to learn from those
experiences. Remember Vajpayee
claiming that china gives up its
claim of Sikkim, and chinese going
back again. The same happened even now
in the Security council permanent
membership. We welcome them with open
hands and show them all our IT prowess
to satellite technology, but nothing
comes out from them. Added to this,
our communists (described as great
"patriots" by Manmohan while assuming
office) want china to be an example
for India. As RSS chief recently
quipped in his interview to NDTV
(Obviously downplayed by English media
over Vajpayee issue), communists
pose a major threat to our country
than even Congress.
Perhaps it is time to learn from past
mistakes and encourage a good relation
ship from Japan. Even we can speak
from our knowledge that, we can always
believe a person who apologises in
public rather than musharaff's and
Hu Jintao's.
Regards,
Viswanathan.
Another recent event - quite in line with the Sino-Japanese relationship outlined in this article - is that the Chinese sub that was chased away by the Japanese subsequently followed by much publicity and supposed apology from the chinese. I remember a discussion around this on BR.
he (Rajeev) needs to reminded that .. what he is .. just a fool .. having his own halucinations.. we just need to look at the economy to see who must be our friend & foe .. be realistic you fool ..
I read your article and frankly your analysis is flawed.
On your point with racism in China -- Wasn't the British responsible for most of it as they used INDIAN COPS who were BRUTAL against the people in Hong Kong during its occupation! Besides, not one beauty queen from India is of the dark skin, so perhaps Indians are just as much racist as Chinese.
As far as the Jap-Indo alliance -- if you can trust the Japanese, then it means you can trust the Americans who end up selling weapons to Pakistan.
Human rights? India has 25% of its population, that's 250 million people in poverty. If that's not human rights violation, i don't know what is. India also have a caste system that will prevent it from reaching superpower status.
After Japanese business people come India and realize just how much bureacracy and BS they have to put up with (can't own the land they operate in, can't do this, can' do that) with India's corruption bigger than China's internal corruption, they'll leave.
You have to realize that hte recent tension between China and Japan is from both extreme sides -- Japanese nationalists, a few of them, are making comments that hurt most of its neighbors, including Korea.
Rajeev, Although your hope is my hope, you are expecting too much from Natwar Singh. I don't know about Manmohan Singh, but 'Nut'war singh is out there to screw India big time....
Nice article!
Despite room for strategic and economic alliances, I think the type of cooperation that strikes a chord with me is the cultural one. I think the Indic culture of Japan is sure to serve as an asset in any form of dealings between India and Japan.
What further intices me is what Rajeev called a loyal partnership for the "long-term". I think this prospect is most attractive, as compared to one possibly with the US, where ideology essentially distills down to a mix between Christian fundamentalism and racism. Therefore, the US as an ally makes sense in the short-term only, but Japan can possibly be one for the long-term due to ideology.
As a noteworthy corollary, Pakistan cannot serve as an ally even in the short term due to it's stark anti-India, Islamic fundamentalist ideology.
Japan and India are the most similar countries in Asia
As an Indian I want to see my countrymen emulate the Japanese in everyway possible.
Having lived in Japan for the past so many years I feel a deep sense of bonding and kinship with the Japanese.
Shintoism and Hinduism are very similar. Just replace "Devas" with "Kami" and there you go.
Also the Japanese worship our Goddess Saraswati in the form of "Benzaiten"
If we Hindus become ten-thousand times cleaner and ten-thousand times politer and ten-thousand times more inventive then we will be very much like the Japanese.
There is also a Japanese form of worship which involves solving Geometry problems (Sangaku) hanging from their temples. It is very interesting and elegant.
Over the years I have collected many such "Sangaku" and wish to construct a Hindu temple in Kerala where devotees are challenged to solve 108 such problems to make the "Guruvayur Appan" Happy.
We Hindus can invent many more such problems.
The Japanese "Zen Garden" is deeply mystifying. Wish we could have Gardens like these consisting of only moss rock and sand in some Indian cities. I am an avid fan of "KarenSansui".
On the whole we should completely blank out China and forge a very strong and deep relationship with Japan.
The enemy of my enemy is always my bossom friend.
Vishnu Sharman
VijayS3@excite.com
A very interesting event occured the other day at the Renkoji temple in Tokyo where Japan's War heros who died during the second world war are honoured.
I was standing in front of the urn of Ashes paying my homage to our departed Netaji in Sanskrit verses I had composed and next to me four other Japanese were paying homage to him in Chaste Japanese.
The incense wielding priest who was officiating the ceremony was Japanese.
In the Jungles of Burma during the last World War where we spilt our blood together fighting Britain, the relationship of our two peoples was forged.
It can only strengthen from here onwards. Japan will be the Hammer and we will be the Anvil on which the evil Chinese nation will be destroyed.
Jai Hind !
Banzai !
Vishnu Sharma.
Furthermore, they have the need to kill off 30 million young men who will never find wives because there are that many 'missing women' from the one-child policy, and they are therefore are likely to be delinquents. The best way to manage their excess energy would be to go to war to ensure a large number of them get killed and cause no further trouble
Furthermore, they have the need to kill off 30 million young men who will never find wives because there are that many 'missing women' from the one-child policy, and they are therefore are likely to be delinquents. The best way to manage their excess energy would be to go to war to ensure a large number of them get killed and cause no further trouble
What Nonsense Rajeev!!!!!
It aint't no nonsense. It is pure sense.
China is like a brewing cup of bitter hot tea in a population "Microwave"
"Imagine Brewing a cup of tea for 30 minutes in a microwave, Everything spills over causing such a smelly mess"
China is all set the burst across its borders and cause the same havoc in Asia which the Germans did in Europe in 1939-1945.
Mark my words, these scum who have no regard for any form of life will
exterminate millions before they are finally crushed like a pestilence.
The Chinese are the main reason why Tigers are disappearing from our forests.
See ! We Indians have another reason to be really worked up against China !
I feel that all the east Asians think themselves to be better than Indians in a racist way --- mainly because India is poor and dirty and India as a country has been a hopeless loser. I guess when India and Indians start winning and appear to be better off -- the feelings would be reciprocated. That's how the world works !
The Chinese are already guilty of Horrendous war crimes without WWIII happening.
Close to 100 million innocent people (Tibetans, Indians, Vietnamese, Americans and Koreans included) have been butchered by the clique of criminals operating from Zhongnanhai.
These vermin will sure cause a lot of trouble in the coming few years.
For once the Japanese should give up their pacifism and the Indians should give up their stupid "no first strike" policy with respect to nukes when it comes to China and Pakistan.
I would say, I would rather have a 1008 nukes deployed to fire off to hit all major Chinese cities at a moment's notice as a precaution against Chinese aggression.
Wow ... there's a wierd mix on this page. 'Firing off nukes', 'Banzai', 'India fighting alongside Japan and Taiwan' ... still fighting a so-20th-century war, are we? Grow up folks - try to think two-three moves ahead.
Rajeev, you have a few things misplaced:
(1) You underestimate Japan's capabilities (they don't need a Johnny come lately to teach them about nuclear weapons/ missiles - they have chosen not to have them), and also how easily these honorable business partners managed to learn (i.e. rip-off technologies) from their western counterparts.
(2) You also miss the fact that we do not have much to offer Japan. In business, they would find investing in India tedious and highly inefficient - yes, they are interested in the domestic market, but is it a truly efficient location for the world market (maybe in a few cases)? Militarily, we don't have even one nuclear-powered aircraft carrier flotilla to bring to their aid. Lets be realistic before we go "rah rah India", and work on building our own strengths (including cleanliness) first.
(3) The Japanese economy is very closed in sectors that are not export oriented - try exporting flowers to Japan (they'll fumigate the entire shipment). So, the opportunities for mutual commerce are more limited. If the US couldn't pry this clam open, you think we can?
(4) I was also amused by your concern about racism by Chinese, given how racist Indians can be (and oblivious to it, too).
I do concur on the Nanjing-Tibet hypocrisy (first thought to my mind too). Ughh! I think I have engaged in a spot of balanced writing - a rarity in these parts.
Piyadasi,
I like you're balanced perspective. My brother lives in Japan and is married to a Japanese woman and so i believe there is definately more scope for a Japan-India alliance then we currently have. The Japanese have a hard time with our hygiene and there are definate language barriers as well but i could see the Japanese auto industry growing in India as the country has a surplus of steel and cheap labor. Also, we are the only country in Asia that doesn't have any vehement anti-Japanese sentiments. The IT sector could be a source of collaboration as well though the language hurdle is significant - most Japanese don't speak english, and then there is health care. As their population ages, someone is going to have to provide them with services - they can only rely on robots to do so much. It'll fall on the Koreans, Phillipinos and Inidians to fill the gap with us being the friendliest group of all.
I have to agree with the racism part. Yes we Indians are racist too so are the Japanese. But I think Indians consider themselves a bit inferior (maybe this is changing now), considering the fact that we let the British take us over for a few centuries. But the chinese on the other hand consider themselves superior to the rest of the world, a fact reinforced by their communist leaders.
Why does India have to choose sides bewteen China and Japan. Wouldn't it be better off if India become a friend of both? What is the point of making an enemy out of a powerful natioin?
Is your main objective to build a stronger and peaceful India, or is it to gang up with one neighbor to destroy another? Wouldn't everyone be happier if the whole neighborhood is safe?
India and China have been neighbors for thousands of years, and for most of that time, the two countries have enjoyed peaceful relationship. The border conflict in the 60's was caused by ambiguity introduced by a British, and encouraged by the rivalries between US and Soviet Union. The conflict was swift and the scope was limited. China has never desired to take over India. On the contrary, India was ENTIRELY occupied and its people were enslaved by Western colonial powers for centuries, and yet it finds them friendly today!
Maybe the last 50 years of history is long enough for you to figure out the long-term strategic direction of India diplomacy, but fortunately, the Indian leaders today can see farther out and keep a balanced relationship with all the powerful nations of the world.
How can one talk of a safe neighbourhood when Tibet has been illegally occupied for the past 50 years. Nepal is next in line with the chinese fomenting a maoist rebellion in that kingdom.
How can one talk of a safe neighbourhood when China is ganging up with Pakistan to torment us and has a military presence in the Cocoa Islands in Burma ?
Wake up and smell the coffee!!!
The chinese navy is making forays into the Bay of Bengal and the Indian ocean. These are exclusively Indian spheres of influence and we cannot tolerate any foreign power in these parts.
If we Indians do not watch out the Chinese will turn india into another Mexico.
No self respecting Indian will put up with their machinations.
China has to be dismembered and destroyed.
Only then peace will return to Asia.
Since the formation of the Chinese communist republic the Chinese have made it a habit of sticking their dirty little fingers into every pie in their neighbourhood.
But for the Chinese we would have had a United Democratic Korea.
and a United Democratic vietnam long ago.
After 60 years of independence, India is still struggling to figure out its place in the world, which bloc it should belong, whose partner it should be, and ultimately, what kind of status it should have.
Meanwhile, China is making headways back to its rightful position in the world - a benevolent super power, just as it once was for more than centuries before not too long ago.
China today has the courage and power to take control of its own fate, standing alone against its adversaries and picking its own friends (rather than being picked). Does India have it?
Marxputra alert! Maoputra alert!
A tribute to the powers of brainwashing. These guys are greater Chinese patriots than Chinese themselves. Then why don't you guys actually go to China? Since you despise India and are very impressed by China, please get Chinese passports and just leave.
Look at the Maoputra rantings here:
1. Japanese killed Indian shopkeepers during WW2. And the reference for this absolutely novel claim is?
2. Chinese are racist towards Indians because British Hong Kong policemen were Indians. And I believe in the tooth fairy.
3. China is such a gentle country, why can't we just get along with them? This is what the chacha also thought, as in bhai-bhai. The Chinese have no such interest, and they cannot get along with anybody because they want to be the king. That's why India cannot get along with them.
4. China the peaceful superpower, as it always has been. Actually China has always been a slave-laboring imperialist hellhole whose people have desperately tried to migrate. And that's exactly what China still is. 900 million peasants enslaved by 200 million coastal city dwellers.
Where do you guys get your history from? K-Mart? Or the Romila Thapar Academy of Manufactured Histories?
In the end
Truth and freedom alone will triumph !
India, along with Japan, Taiwan, Vietnam, Thailand, Laos, and Burma
will complete the encirclement and strangulation of China.
The Chinese dictatorship will and should perish.
Tibet will be free once more.
There will be smile on everybody's face in Asia.
Yatho Dharma, Stato Jaya !!
Yes, these times are hard when we see the evil(Chinese) on the ascendency.
But have hope my countrymen, in the end India will be holding China by the neck and dunking her repeatedly in a mud pool before a world audience.
I think we need to take up where Japan left off after WWII and start forming a "Greater Asia Co-Prosperity zone" which includes
Nepal, Burma, Bhutan, Thailand, Laos, Vietnam, The Philipines, Taiwan and of course Japan.
Our aim will to promote Democracy and free market economy in all these regions and form a single currency. Let us call this AU
Asiatic Union (Remember EU)
This will happen only after a major military campaign is launched from the Indian Subcontinent and Indo-China to destroy China totally.
Just like EU keeps Russia out
We need to keep China out also.
As far as Asia is concerned, the chinese are pariahs and we should beat them on the head and make them kneel.
Vishnu.
The Chicoms (chinese commies) are as amoral as the French (w/o the cowardliness, IMO), as power hungry as the islamofascists, as calmly pragmatic as the Zen masters, and as cunning as Machieveli when it comes to int'l dealings.
1. They've signed up bigtime deals with genocidal Sudan and a rabidly hysterical Iran for oil and gas.
2. They've supported the most dastardly regimes on Earth like North Korea and Cuba for profit.
3. They've committed cultural genocide in Tibet and in the Chinese hinterland in the 60s.
4. They've territorial disputes with every single one of their neighbours.
5. They've de facto surrounded India with military bases in Pakistan (via the Gwadar port), Myanmar soon now Bangladesh all the while angling to get into Nepal as well.
Japan, Taiwan and Singapore, as the 3 Asian countries other than India, with the most to lose should chicom power in Asia rise to unchallenged levels would logically look to teaming up to face the threat.
Anyone remember the last time the Chinese enthusiastically peddled the India-China-Russia axis against the US? We do live in interesting times, eh?
Silly Indians, go ahead and fantasize about "destroying China" with your Jap(Who would have been as savage toward the Indians as they were to the Chinese if they ever got to India like they planned) "allies". 62' hurts doesn't it?
Chinese and their little lambs like the poster above are scared of Japan, because they beat the crap out of the Chinese during WW2. They are also scared of Vietnam which beat the shit out of the Chinese army when they invaded in 1979. Shoo, little Maoputra, the Vietnamese are going to come after your ass.
This message is for the stinking Chinku (Chinese Scum) who dares to post to our forum.
Who know tomorrow there will be another Nanjing when both Indian and Japanese troops march in.
This time both Japanese and Indians will be celebrating the killing contests and be complementing each others on their scores.
Ha Ha !
Perhaps the record of "250000 chinese mercilessly slaughtered" will then be exceeded. Hopefully we will reach the million mark this time.
In response to the two clowns above:
Apparently reality just can not penetrate the thick skulls of the elephant-dung worshipers. The gig is up for Japan, their savage act toward the people who gave them everything they had will never be forgotten by an awoken and rising China. No, there will not be another Nanking except in your fantasies. Maybe a "Tokyo massacre" instead. As for India, try not to delude yourselves into thinking that Japs actually give a damn or have a single ounce of respect for your pitiful "civilization".
P.S.As much as I hold the Japs in contempt, the idea that they would need Indian "assistance" to build nukes is the funniest thing I've heard in ages.
Chinaman
Interesting. This piece of shit is foul-mouthed enough to be a real Chinese. All Chinese are obnoxious bastards.
On the other hand, he cannot be a Chinese for two reasons. One, he actually can write two sentences that make are understandable. Real Chinese are completely incoherent.
Two, he says 'Nanking'. A true Chinese would only say 'Nanjing'.
Therefore, it is a Maoputra masquerading as a Chinese. How pathetic! An Indian commie-bastard who so wants to be Chinese that he pretends to be one.
Oops, I wrote an incoherent sentence above. The incoherence is spreading. Even talking about Chinese makes one incoherent.
I meant "two sentences that are understandable"
And Maoputra, wait until all of us gang up on your Chinese gods and bomb your piss-ant promised land to kingdom come. Please read the bestseller 'Yellow Peril' written by a Taiwanese.
"On the other hand, he cannot be a Chinese for two reasons. One, he actually can write two sentences that make are understandable. Real Chinese are completely incoherent."
Anyone who uses grammar like "two sentences that make are understandable" has no right to others for "incoherence".
"Two, he says 'Nanking'. A true Chinese would only say 'Nanjing'.
Therefore, it is a Maoputra masquerading as a Chinese. How pathetic! An Indian commie-bastard who so wants to be Chinese that he pretends to be one."
No, I'm not a "Maoputra" (whatever hell that means). I'm a Chinese in America who happened to stumble upon this site and who was appalled by the vicious venom directed at Chinese. So I decided to give you a taste of your own medicine.
And Maoputra, wait until all of us gang up on your Chinese gods and bomb your piss-ant promised land to kingdom come. Please read the bestseller 'Yellow Peril' written by a Taiwanese.
Again, more fantasizing by Indians. No, I don't need to read some filth by a traitor Chinese to understand that yes, there really are people that hate China and want to see it go down.
You lying turd, you Maoputra, you are no Chinese, you are merely an Indian commie bastard.
About 90% of the people outside China hate China. Only Maoputras like you in India like China. Everyone else hates China and the stinking Chinese.
So you don't want to face the reality that I'm Chinese? Then go ahead and believe whatever you want. From now on I will sign my name as "Maoputra". This is only an internet chat room and we can't see each other.
"About 90% of the people outside China hate China. Only Maoputras like you in India like China. Everyone else hates China and the stinking Chinese."
No, 90% of the people outside China do not hate China. And you know what? Even if it's true we could care less about what others think of us. We want to look after our own interests only and that's what will make us strong. Unlike the Indians who are always worried about how whites in the West will view them.
Maoputra
I saw a classic piece by stand up comedian "Russel Peters" yesterday about India-China business.
RP: "There is a difference in the way Indians and Chinese do trade and due to this we can never be partners. Indians bargain and Chinese do the opposite. I went to this mall and saw this purse in the Chinese store."
RP: "Hey man, what the price of this purse?"
CSO(Chinese store owner):35 dollars
RP:"I will buy it for 30 dollars."
CSO:"No, 30 dollars too low, I do that I close store"
RP: "come on man, cut me a deal. I will buy the stuff"
CSO:"OK, let me ask my wife.. **** chineses talk****. OK, you seem to be a nice guy, I will give you excellent price.. $34.50."
RP:"oh man, 50 cents!!! what will I do with that?"
CSO:"50 cents too low now. but you go to next store, save 50 cents more, thats one dollar. then you go to dollar store and buy something!!!"
RP:"I dont want your purse man"
CSO:"Be a man. do the right thing. if you dont buy now you loose the excellent deal. you go ahead, then you come back, the purse will be $40. so, be a man. do the right thing"
Prasank: I rest my case...
As an Indian I do mot have a problem with the Singapore Chinese, or Taiwanese. These people are still like the traditional Chinese and believe in Confucius amd Tao.
If the mainland Chinese were like that, then we would not have had the Korean War, the invasion of Tibet, the debacle of 1962, the Vietnam war and the Cambodian Genocide,the brutal occupation of Hong Kong and nuclear weapons proliferation.
But unfortunately for Asia, Mainlnd China was
bitten by the red Bug.
Just like Europe had to go through a Red crisis from 1945-1989.
We in Asia will also have to suffer the same for some time. After which the Chinese system
will collapse and the Xinjiang and Tibet will
become independent.
We Indians, SouthEast asians, Japanese and Koreans will have to just wait out this Red Peril.
In the mean time we should form an AU like the EU, like another blogger suggested while keeping Red China out because of its dismal human rights.
Prasank,
India itself may not have such a decent human right record as you wish.
The most basic human right is the right to survive, and to make a
sustainable living. Here are the numbers.
Life Expetctancy (years): China 73, India 62
Poverty Line (% of total population): China 3%, India 30%
Poverty Line (number in millions): China 40 million, India 300 million
Maternal mortality Rate (Rate per 100,000): China 42, India 410
Literacy Level: China 91%, India 65%
The poverty line is defined by the UN standard as income below $365/year.
I believe you can come up with a reaonsable explanation for these numbers.
India has its own difficulty in social and economic devleopment, and it
is making remarkable progress in addressing these issues. But please
do understand that China has its own issues, its own history and culture
background. The Chinese political system may not be the best in the world,
but it is the choice Chinese people made more than 50 years ago, and they
are also making good progress to improve and adjust. Please respect their
history and their choice, just as they have done to you.
Western media has the tendency to demonize China, mostly because it was
once Red, and it is now powerful enough to compete with them. When India
has that kind of power someday, you can count on them to do the same
to India.
I am glad to see the leaders of the two nations are working towards a
peaceful and mutually beneficial relationship between them. China needs
a break after more than one century of warfare and chaos to rebuild
itself, and sure India can use the chance to focus on its own development.
Mr Prasank,
Who ever you are. It is turncoats and termites like you who undermine India and need to be under lock and key for life.
Please do not white wash China's record. If the former Soviet Union
was an "Evil Empire" the present day PRChina is 1000 times more evil.
I feel like gagging when I come across weasels like you who parrot
China's achievements.
The Marxist bug needs to be once for all exterminated from India and Asia.
Death to Marxism and Maosim !!
Long live the Golden Chrysanthimum and the Dharma Chakra !!!!!!
To the strains of the Japanese National Anthem "Kimigayo"
I can already visualize the glorious Red sun rising above the turbulent seas in the distant horizon and showering our
two great Nations with his blessings for cementing a friendship which will last 10000 years and beyond.
Please do not interrupt me from
my meditations !
Vishnu
Gentleman who compared the Chinese & Indian poverty rates , can you provide the source of that data?
Chinese are master liars(dieties of Thapars,Surjeets) just like our Leftists. They are experts to cook-up stories about their flawed socio-economics (remember 'kerala meeaawdel of development?).
RAM
To the Chinese gentleman who produced the statistics:
I am tired of explaing in detail the flawed logic behind $365/year in various forums. Anyway, let me explain this in very short way,
$365/year = $1/day : Now, you claim that you are a Chinese student in US, can you please explain to me any way someone can survive in US with that kind of money?
$1 = 8.8 yuan/day: is this enough for someone in China to survive? I dont know...
$1 = Rs. 48/day: Now, I wont claim this is enough for a living. But, with this much amount, one can defenitely survive. In short, Rs. 48 actually goes more way than $1.
Now, the above explanation was assuming that the Chiense data was correct. But I doubt the validity of that data very much...
And dear Vishnu, you seem to have confused some other post with mine. Please calm yourself down... meditation is good.
Dear Prasank,
Terribly sorry about my earlier missive.
Using flawless logic you have pointed out to the "Chinaman" that
merely brandishing Statistics does not reveal the true picture.
India's fortunes lie with doing good business with Japan who have a transparent media and a democracy. They are indeed a clean people.
China, is today guilty in a massive way of the crimes it accuses Japan of committing 60+ years ago. Funny, how the Chinese even have the face to Cry about "Nanking" when Tibet is an unfolding "hellfire" as we speak.
What is good for the goose is good for the Gander also.
You cannot hide skeletons inside a glossy closet and ask me to look at the intricate carvings on the closet and be impressed and appreciative.
All of China's advances have come at a massive expense of human rights. "Adharma" and "Himsa" have exceeded all limits in that country.
Life is cheap in China and so is labour. All the Chinese goods you see in the markets worldwide is a product of "slave labour" and torture. 40% of Chinese have enslaved 60% of their illiterate countrymen who are toiling away in
concentration camps for food which they get once a day.
All this will come out of the closet when the communist system collapses.
Vishnu.
His Excellency, the Japanese premier has arrived in New Delhi!
Let us all bless his trip.
I hope the gamut of issues are discussed and India and Japan
forge a solid partnership in
all matters that are related
to
Defense, Commerce and Culture.
The next time an Indian Head of State visits Japan, he should make it a point to visit the Yasukuni Jinja and the Renkoji temple to convey his deepest respects to Japan's and India's fallen heros who are enshrined there in.
"To the strains of the Japanese National Anthem "Kimigayo"
I can already visualize the glorious Red sun rising above the turbulent seas in the distant horizon and showering our
two great Nations with his blessings for cementing a friendship which will last 10000 years and beyond."
Vishnu:
The pitiful Indian inferiority complex reveals itself quite blatantly in your postings. In its everlasting quest to beg "endorsement" and "approval" from others the Indian is willing to kneel down and shame himself beyond comprehension. Yesterday it was the white Europeans today it is Japan. But know you not that respect can not be granted by others and must be earned by yourself?
Sad
Maoputra (Chinaman)
P.S. I'm not the one who posted the statistics. From now on all my posts will have the "Maoputra" signature.
After scanning his articles on Rediff.com I find it interesting that this incompetent writer (Rajeev Srinivasan) has so much venom for China. Rare is the article that does not contain some cheap shot at either the Chinese people or Chinese culture (not to mention the Chinese government). Sure China made a brief incursion into India in 62. But what is that compared to what Britain has done to India? Yet he seems to be quite fond of India's former masters. I guess he just reflects the Indian belief that whites are superior and therefore anything they do is excusable while everything the "Chinku" does has to be damned to hell. What is it that angers Srinivasan so much about China? Could it be his exaggerated Japanophilia? Jealousy that despite the fact that India never had to deal with a real Communist government it still lags behind China in almost every way? Or is it the fact that unlike its Indian counterpart, Chinese civilization was created entirely by Chinese people themselves and not brought to them by some nomads from Central Asia?
Maoputra(Chinaman)
Maoputra, you are an Indian commie bastard. Everything you say shows absolutely no knowledge of China other than what an armchair Indian commie bastard knows. Also, you contradict yourself. If you are such a proud Chinese asshole, why are you living in America? And why are you posting anonymously? Provide us your proud Chinese email id. So you are not what you claim you are. You are an Indian commie bastard FOIL member, a parasite who is scared of Homeland Security.
In terms of Chinese 'civilization' here is some interesting stuff:
1. Chinese Trade in Human Foetuses for Consumption is Uncovered
By Yojana Sharma in Hong Kong and Graham Hutchings in Beijing
London Electronic Telegraph, 13 April 1995
ABORTED human foetuses intended for human consumption are being sold for
as little as 1 pound in the Chinese city of Shenzhen, according to reports in
Hong Kong yesterday.
The Eastern Express newspaper said journalists from its sister
publication, Eastweek, had gone to Shenzhen, across the border from Hong
Kong, to see if foetuses were being sold. Shenzhen hospitals carried out
7,000 terminations last year, including a number on Hong Kong women seeking
cheap abortions.
At the state-run Shenzhen Health Centre for Women and Children, a female
doctor was asked for a foetus. The next day, she handed the reporter a
"fist-sized glass bottle stuffed with thumb-sized foetuses".
The doctor was quoted as saying: "There are 10 foetuses here, all
aborted this morning. You can take them. We are a state hospital and don't
charge. Normally we doctors take them home to eat - all free. Since you
don't look well, you can take them."
At private clinics, aborted foetuses could be obtained for between 1 and
1.75, the newspaper said. There was no evidence, however, that foetuses were
being sold in large quantities to middlemen for sale in Hong Kong.
Zou Qin, a doctor working at the Luo Hu Clinic in Shenzhen, said the
foetuses were "nutritious" and claimed to have eaten 100 herself in the past
six months.
She said the "best" were first-born males from young women. "We don't
carry out abortions just to eat the foetuses," she said, but added that the
foetuses would be "wasted if not eaten". The newspaper said the foetuses
were eaten as a soup, together with pork and ginger.
A woman doctor, referred to only as Wang, from the Sin Hua Clinic,
Shenzhen, was quoted as saying the foetuses were "even better than placentae"
in nutritional value. "They can make your skin smoother, your body stronger
and are good for kidneys," she said.
Dr Warren Lee, president of the Hong Kong Nutrition Association, said:
"Eating foetuses is a traditional Chinese medicine deeply founded in
folklore." However, he considered the alleged properties of foetuses little
more than old-wives' tales. Others said the practice was abhorrent.
The sale and consumption of placentae is common in China Dr. Cao Shilin,
of the Hospital of Chinese medicine in Shenzhen, said aborted embryos were
taken to factories where they were used in the production of medicines.
She did not know if any were sold to private individuals, but said there
was little medical value in embryos older than eight weeks when, in Chinese
terms, they were classified as foetuses.
She had not heard of foetuses being sold in Shenzhen, but warned that
eating them could be dangerous, given the strong medicines used in abortions.
A doctor in Beijing, who declined to be named, said parts of foetuses
would have medical value, singling out the liver as something that could help
to cure anaemia.
But hospitals in Beijing had ovens for the destruction of aborted
foetuses, and she had not heard that they had been sold for individual
consumption.
The sale and consumption of placentae is common in China, though frowned
upon by the authorities. Only those with good connections to the medical
world can obtain placentae, which cost between 2.50 and 3 each.
According to traditional Chinese medicine, it is regarded as
particularly beneficial for a nursing mother to eat her own placenta because
it improves her milk. It is usually drunk in the form of a soup.
Chinaman,
This is Japanese nationalist writing here.
Japan and India are linked inextricably by an Indic culture which the Chinese also had to a small extent before that criminal Mao sprang a surprise on them.
You forget that just a 100 years ago you were a nation of Opium addicts who forced their wives into prostitution to keep the habit. Which is why we had so many comfort women in the Japanese army. Also everything the Chinese claim to be their invention is actually from India.
The ink you falsely claim to be yours, the Remainder theoram, paper, silk, tea, rockets etc. Everything you have, has been begged, borrowed or stole from India. Even your seat in the UN security council.
We have learnt in our history textbooks that before the
Advent of Confucius, Taoism and Buddhism the Chinese were
basically cavemen.
Perhaps "Gratitude" is a word missing in the Chinese dictionary. There are more Buddhist Chinese and Buddhist Japanese today than Buddhist Indians which explains why
historians regard India as a great nation.
Because she conquered and civilized Asia without firing a shot.
We Japanese can never respect the Chinese because we
have seen in what state they were in the 1930s.
Also the Indians, Koreans, Taiwanese and vietnamese at least acknowledge the struggle we fought on behalf of them against the western powers. Even in Singapore Japanese are always welcome. Our ideals were pure during WWII. Why should we apologize to all and sundry ?
It is only natural that Japan, Korea, Taiwan and Vietnam join hands with India to destroy the dangerous Dragon that the Chinese have become in the belly of Asia.
Reflect before you post again !
To the self-described Japanese Nationalist:
Your inane response shows your stupidity. I will now debunk every one of your claims:
"You forget that just a 100 years ago you were a nation of Opium addicts who forced their wives into prostitution to keep the habit. Which is why we had so many comfort women in the Japanese army."
Nonsense. The Chinese conflict with Japan started long after the Opium Wars and the suppression of the Opium habit by the Qing government and Lin Zexu. By the time the Sino-Japanese war started opium was virtually nonexistent in China. And many of the "comfort women" came from Korea and Taiwan which never had to deal with opium. What a sad attempt to justify Japanese perversion. This is the same people that grope women all the time in their subway statins.
"We have learnt in our history textbooks that before the
Advent of Confucius, Taoism and Buddhism the Chinese were
basically cavemen."
This is simply childish. Everyone was a barbarian before humans became civilized. And China is no exception.
"Perhaps "Gratitude" is a word missing in the Chinese dictionary. There are more Buddhist Chinese and Buddhist Japanese today than Buddhist Indians which explains why
historians regard India as a great nation.
Because she conquered and civilized Asia without firing a shot."
What? Just because Buddhism came from India (Actually Buddha was a central Asian tribe prince) and a small percentage of chiense are buddist does not make India a great nation.
"Also everything the Chinese claim to be their invention is actually from India. The ink you falsely claim to be yours, the Remainder theoram, paper, silk, tea, rockets etc. Everything you have, has been begged, borrowed or stole from India. Even your seat in the UN security council."
Do you have ANY evidence that back these ridiculous claims? It is well known that these things were invented by the Chinese and that the vast majoirty of things asociated along with CHina is indigenous CHinese. Unlike the Japanese, who stole everything from China. The first rule when you want to criticize someone for a perceived fault is to make sure that you are not guilty of that fault yourself. It is well known that the only thing Japanese are capable of is copying and stealing the inventions of others. Just because you don't want to face that fact does not mean you can make it go away by accusing others of the same thing.
"We Japanese can never respect the Chinese because we
have seen in what state they were in the 1930s."
We do not need your shameless nation to respect us. Nobody is claiming we were in great shape in the 30s. It was an historical anomality. Japan was in much worse shape before we Chinese civilized you. But you will FEAR us now that we have whipped ourselves in shape and will not forget to exact revenge on a nation that returned our kindness with savage brutality.
"Also the Indians, Koreans, Taiwanese and vietnamese at least acknowledge the struggle we fought on behalf of them against the western powers. Even in Singapore Japanese are always welcome. Our ideals were pure during WWII. Why should we apologize to all and sundry ?"
What? Replacing one colonial master with a more brutal one should be celebrated? What pure ideals are you talking about? Butchering pregnant women? Your apologies are worthless and you will pay for your crimes in due time.
Maoputra (Chinaman)
P.S. Apparently no person who posts here can form a coherent, logical argument. Nobody is near my level in eloquence or intelligence. Therefore I will now only respond to select posts.
quote:
"Apparently no person who posts here can form a coherent, logical argument. Nobody is near my level in eloquence or intelligence. Therefore I will now only respond to select posts."
Claiming Bihar to be in Central Asia shows your intelligence level and your level for logical arguement. The last sentence in your post shows your eloquence level. It doesnt matter if you post or not, its entirely up to you and doesnt make the smallest difference to me.
Also, this is someone's personal blog. It will be nice if everyone remember that and behave accordingly.
Hi Shadow Warrior,
You should consider posting the following on your blog:
By Jim Hoagland, Washington Times
"Don't Let China Off The Hook"
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A22530-2005Jan19.html
Thanks
Maoputra
Please check up your geography.'Buddha - a prince in Central Asia' -Apparently the eastern part of India is now in Central Asia.
You seem to demand a lot of respect for Chinese culture and the country. Please do the courtesy of returning some respect. All we say is Quid pro quo. It is not evident from your postings. You do not seem to acknowledge Indian civilizational greatness.
Oh before I forget, the fact that India has a borrowed civilization from tribes of Central Asia has been proved to be phony. I can guide you to the places wher you can read up on it.
hey you stupid Maoputra,
you must surely be a chinku. i can clearly see that now from your writings. it is only stupid chinkoos who are taught that Gautama Buddha was born in central asian tribe. ofcourse, everyone knows that chinese history books are rewritten by the latest strongman to suit him. seems like the strongman during your education didnt like the fact that Buddha and even Zen Bhuddhism came from India.
listenup you ignorant foo. Bhuddha was from Pataliputra, which is current day Patna. And Zen Bhuddhism founder Bhodi Dharma (whose name you chinks cannot even pronounce properly and change it to Damma or something else) came from South India.
SO you chinks have borrowed big time from India and now you tell me that Bhuddha was not from India?
This only shows how ungrateful chinese are to India for giving china everything - even tea was brought to your chinku lands by Indian Bhodo Dharma.
so better dont open your chinku mouth and show your gross ignorance.
-A
Maoputra
You speak about pleasing masters white men and Japanese. First Indian culture is inclusive. We respect other cultures and races. We do not have any artificial racial superiority complex like you. Second even though we may have suffered at the hands of others: Muslims, White men etc, we do not cry and scream about it decades after the events. Lastly note even our Prime minister and President are from so called minorities. Look at your political class in contrast. We do not even see a tibetan, mongol etc even in the lower cadres.
Lastly gratitude is definitely missing in your dictionary. You have prospered due to the white men and JApanese investing in your economy while note Indian economy and its industries are driven by private entrepreneurs. Yet you have nothing but abuse for them
Please reply and mention if there is anything false in the statements.
Japanese Warrior "SamuraiSan" writing:
Maoputra (Chinaman) wrote:
P.S. Apparently no person who posts here can form a coherent, logical argument. Nobody is near my level in eloquence or intelligence. Therefore I will now only respond to select posts.
These kind of self-congratulatory statements can come from only deluded fools.
The Chinese have been deluded for the past 50 years.
They have no respect for other cultures. The barbarity of the Mongols seems to have seeped into the bones of the current day chinese.
We in Japan were fortunate to be rescued by two "Kamikazis" when the
Chinese tried to set foot on our sacred soil twice in the past.
The Chinese think that they are going to avenge "Nanking".
Mark my words, It will never happen.
The chinese cannot harm even a hair
of a Japanese man without their hands withering and dropping off their bodies.
Next time the Chinese try to attack Nippon, then retribution
will come from both USA and India
in the form of a Nuclear Whirlwind.
Also we Japanese vehemently oppose
Chinese "One Nation" policy.
Taiwan was formerly our domain
and china will face severe consequences if she dares to cast her eyes across the Taiwan strait.
Do not try our patience !
Learn to be contented !!!
Look at India, Sri-Lanka lies just
off the coast of India. But does India talk of invading or absorbing
Sri Lanka ?
It is the Chinese who are causing all the problems in Asia since 1949.
We Japanese are experts in making this people kneel down and fear us.
Also do not under-estimate India
The way they cleaved Pakistan in 1971 to create Bangladesh was like a Samurai sword coming down.
It was done in three weeks.
India is very patient with all the prodding and pinching she receives from her rowdy neighbours. But if she gets upset, then watchout !
In Japan, We have a saying
"When you behead somebody do it elegantly in a single stroke"
-SamuraiSan.
Now we have a Jap onboard. Sh*t attracts flies.
Buddha from some cetral asian tribe? - the chinese are heavily brainwashed products. Commies who are influenced by this kind of history make a saint out of aurangazeb-no wonder.
Hi, I'm a Chinese living in America who is REPULSED by a lot of what Chinaman has written.
India is clearly a source of much of Chinese culture and civilization -- religion, folklore, music, language, mathematics, food, and astronomy, just to name a little. To deny that is ridiculous.
And Siddhartha Gautama was not a Central Asian prince, good grief. He was either from present-day Nepal, or from present-day India. Both are in South Asia. I wonder if the other Chinese poster is aware of Fa Hsien's and Xuanzang's and many other monks' trips to INDIA for Buddhist knowledge -- not Central Asia.
Improved relations between all countries is a good thing, though. As others have said, why not India and Japan, *and* India and Communist China?
There are certainly human rights problems with Communist China, and also in India (casteism, communalism, apparently brutal tactics in the Northeast and Kashmir). But only by all countries engaging with each other can there be progress on human rights.
The last thing this world needs is more military hostilites, more tensions.
It's good to be wary of Communist China, but stupid to form a military alliance to "contain" it when there is no evidence that it wants to expand its borders.
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