hi folks, i am running around, have too much to do and wont be getting access to the internet for a few days. please expect normal activity to resume on june 1.
I had taken break from this blog for India visit. Also I was very disappointed with state election results which I thought would result in collapse of ulta pulta alliance(Assam changing hands, AIADMK returning power in Tamilnadu and DMK losing endangering UPA, Communists having just majority in Bengal, Hung assembly in Kerala with BJP making maiden entry in Manjeshwaram and Palghat). However the way stock market is tanking, Aaaj ka Arjun's reservation drama and Madmohan' absolute surrender to US by not testing Agni3 my gut feeling is that snap polls are in October. After Mandal 1 VP's party came down from 3 digits(141 same as Sonia's congress) to 2 digits with most seats coming in from Bihar and few from UP due to Ajith Singh. If Mandal 2 happens same thing is going to happen to Sonias congress already absent from most of Indias major states. A dud in the manger?
By Brahma Chellaney
May 22, 2006
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Which state invests the bulk of its defence modernisation resources not on strengthening its own armament base or deterrent capabilities but on subsidising the military industrial complex of others? In which country do scientists confront political obstacles to the maturation of indigenous capabilities? Where have profligate arms imports become the main source of metastasising corruption?
The answer is India. If a three-year national moratorium were declared on the import of any new weapon system, it will help clean up politics and public discourse without compromising the defence of India. A net saving of at least $15 billion will also accrue. Note the oddity that at the very time the government is moving to import 126 medium combat aircraft (MCA), it has put on indefinite hold the maiden flight-test of the Agni 3 intermediate-range missile. Why the awkwardness to test an indigenous ballistic missile but the lack of political embarrassment to import high-priced warplanes? After all, an MCA and Agni 3 can carry out similar missions -- deliver a nuclear or conventional payload against an intended target.
Manned aircraft are militarily no less potent than ballistic missiles. They also rival missiles as pre-emption weapons. Yet the cost of acquiring, manufacturing and maintaining missiles is indubitably far less than that of strike aircraft.
The import of 126 fighters will cost between $ 7 billion and $ 9.2 billion with the full package, including onboard weaponry and advanced radar warning system. With the US expecting to clinch the deal, the cost range reflects the price differential between the obsolescent F-16s at the lower end and the technically troubled F/A-18s at the upper end. (The US is not offering India its latest F-35s, a project involving eight foreign partners.)
It might shock many to know that India’s cumulative investments in its missile capabilities total barely 5.6 per cent of what it will cost to buy the F-16s. The entire investment in the Integrated Guided Missile Development Programme (IGMDP) from its 1983 inception up to December 2005 aggregated Rs 1771.4 crore, or $ 389 million. Despite lagging behind its regional missile needs, India has, in the recently approved annual budget, earmarked for missile development only $ 20.6 million. The ubiquitous foreign arms dealers in town will turn up their noses at such a trifling amount.
Why the rush to import warplanes despite the diffidence to test an Agni 3? Allegations of kickbacks in the last mega-deal -- the $ 3.4-billion Scorpene submarine contract -- have yet to quieten down. Even if the issue of commissions was set aside, any independent investigations will reveal the dubious value of some of the arms contracts India has signed. Other than the Sukhoi-30 heavy combat aircraft (HCA) and the three early-warning Phalcon radar systems aboard Ilyushin-76 planes, what imported weapons give India the military edge it needs?
India may be poor, but its decision-makers are pretty generous in awarding arms contracts to foreign vendors. Like oil sheikhs, they are now signing import deals worth between $ 4 billion and $ 6 billion every year. This is not, mind you, due to ignorance of world history: no country has become a major military power through reliance on arms imports. Rather, the arms-import mania reflects a spreading rot in the system, as underlined by the Navy War Room leak case.
Ask yourself: will India be stronger with 126 new strike aircraft or, at a fraction of their cost, with 126 Agni 3s? If India were to buy the F/A-18s, the value of that single deal will surpass the country’s aggregate investments in the past decade in defence research and development, including strategic systems — nuclear and missile. By the levels of OECD nations and China, India’s defence R&D spending is abysmally low. China spends 28 per cent of its huge military budget on R&D and an extra 5 per cent just on missiles. India together spends 6.1 per cent of its defence outlays on R&D and missiles.
Is it thus any surprise that the import lobbies in New Delhi are so strong? Or that India has shelved the Agni 3 while it pursues the strike-aircraft purchase? Helping Britain safeguard 5,000 jobs, including 2,200 at Brough, East Yorkshire, India awarded a $ 1.9 billion contract to BAE Systems for the out-of-date Hawk jet trainer. But the total DRDO budget for the current year is just 63 per cent of that -- $ 1.19 billion. Out of this, 35 per cent, or a meagre $ 419 million, will go toward developing capabilities at the core of India’s future: nuclear, missile and nuclear-submarine systems.
A country should defend itself largely with the armaments it can produce, not with the pricey imported toys its forces may want. If this tenet were to dictate policy, India could greatly boost its manufacturing capabilities and create tens of thousands of jobs at home through a vibrant military industrial complex. From being the world’s largest arms importer, India would emerge as a worthy exporter. Given that India has not fought a full-fledged war in 35 years and is unlikely to face full-scale aggression in the next decade, it is possible to implement in stages such a principle.
In this light, the Agni 3 test freeze is troubling. India’s primary focus ought to be on preventing aggression through indigenous deterrent assets, not on seeking to defeat aggression with extravagant weapons from abroad. Yet the PM has acted quite the reverse — from accepting nuclear-capability limits under a misbegotten deal with the US to providing assurances on multibillion-dollar imports of US arms and reactors. The Agni 3 test freeze epitomises the mounting costs of the nuclear deal. In fact, in the period since Rajiv Gandhi conducted the first Agni test exactly 17 years ago, the Agni programme has been significantly crimped by a succession of weak, vacillating PMs.
A solid-fuelled system with an advanced flex nozzle, the Agni 3 has a twice-bigger motor and 50 per cent larger payload capacity than Agni 2. Pranab Mukherjee has cited ‘a self-imposed restraint’ to rationalise the test hold-up. India has not tested a ballistic missile since August 2004. In that period, China has aggressively pushed ahead with its new DF-31 and DF-41 ICBMs and Pakistan has carried out multiple tests of Chinese-origin missiles, including three tests in the past three months -- the Shaheen 2 (an ostensible match to Agni 2), Babur cruise missile and Abdali short-range missile. India’s own assessment shows it has fallen behind even Pakistan on missiles, with Islamabad having assembled and deployed in underground silos almost 100 Shaheen 1s and about 20 to 24 of Shaheen 2s.
Mukherjee claims “we want to keep our international commitments on non-proliferation”. Who will enlighten the illustrious defence minister that there is no missile non-proliferation regime in existence and India thus could not have made ‘international commitments’? The MTCR is neither an international agreement nor a treaty but an informal and voluntary technology-control arrangement among some nations. If he is alluding to some secret commitments to the US, how do they become ‘international’ in nature?
It is easy to figure out why the US wishes to stall the dirt-cheap Agni 3 while it aggressively moves to sell expensive strike aircraft to India. By deciding to sell dozens of F-16s to Pakistan, it is creating and exploiting an Indian need to import fighters. The best CBM India and Pakistan can agree to -- a CBM that will yield a true and lasting peace dividend -- is to forego purchase of new fighters and open a regular dialogue on observing arms-import restraints. This is a CBM the merchants of death will seek to scuttle.
The Agni 3 test freeze, in effect since January when the missile became ready, will last months more. Having missed the May deadline, the next opening to test will come only in September after the monsoons. But the nuclear-deal saga is unlikely to be over by then. The PM’s freeze actually does a disservice to the deal he is obsessed with. A test would have sent a clear message that India is going to have a deterrent force and, like it or not, the US can either accept that reality in partnership with India or counter-productively oppose it. Didn’t the 1998 nuclear tests lead the US to court India?
Yet another example of the hypocritical values of the dynasty clan and their personal party. But certainly one worth reading in light of current events.
A powerful idea is mightier than the sword. Look at how Gujarat is handling the aggressive Amir Khan. His new picture won't be screened in multiplexes in Gujarat. His producer is on knees...
Let us note that every person has a voice .. he should know how to make it heard. He can choose to be shrill and maniac, like Arundhati Roy and Medha Patkar, or he can use a purposeful and firm voice.
I hope those who are against reservations think of their power. Choose a channel! That is all you need to do, and talk in one voice. More about this later.
I guess the community is so fractured and weak that one doesn;t even hear much voices of protest.. most of the some-what powrful among the brahmins aare anyway in the US . Some are in politics and they would keep their lips sealed for fear of losing political career
I think it is important to expose the real people behind the reservation, and the real people behind the reservation is not arjun singh. Arjun Singh is a small time politician who has sensed where he has better oppurtinity for becoming grand.
In my opinion reservation is less harmful, if the real mafia and their reasons of hate are mentioned. If not this mafia would spread to enslave more people.
Getting sympathy from the mafia is a no no for all, especially those who have more info. Thats what the mafia wants, to purchase people by giving them jobs and economic benifits.
The govt is smart - now it says to buy more people of one caste by giving reservation, by people of another caste by increasing seats. Let none be purchased.
Have a look @ the image of the Italian Barmaid (IB) and her lap-dogs --the dumb Sardar and the senile old-fart Arjun Singh -- cut-outs of whom are propped up @ AIIMS campus in Delhi, on Rediff:
http://www.rediff.com/news/2006/may/24look1.htm
The IB keeping her 'pets' on the leash ---the title seems to be misleading with whats being witnessed all-around in India --one wonder's how or Is it that these morons and inbeciles are just doing their mistress bidding...
IF any of you guys can point out as to how to post that image here, the way sometimes you embed hyper-links in your posts (no knowledge as to how you do it), that'd be fine, 'coz I think with the way Rediff has gradually become a Congi mouthpiece, that image won't be there for long...
We Indians sure know how to shoot ourselves in the foot, and at this time when the world is watching in awe and should say jealousy, as to how India has carved out a place for itself in knowledge sphere, thanx to the divisionary tactics of these nincompoop politicians, we sure will be back to where we started from and the world will again steal a march over us... a sense of deja-vu all over again!
Wonder, how long its gonna be before the avg. Indian voter wakes up and shows these gutter-level creatures that all these old policies of divide-and-rule no longer work.... but hey whom am I talking to... these morons (the voters for a change in this case) who returned the commies and the pinkos back to power in Waste Bengal and Kerala --- they sure prove that old adage true:
Another good article by Tavleen Singh. How do we help medicos on non cooperation movement. Here is few of my ideas.
1) Start withdrawing money from Public sector banks. If everybody starts doing it (Even if 3% of people start withdrawing) and start shifting to private banks there will be massive panic.
2) Since stock market has already fallen why not ask every person to withdraw and tell sell orders to brokerage. If stock market falls the first casuality will be Chidambaram and next UPA govt.
3) Ask UPA to practise what it preaches. HRD minister should be given to a OBC. Finance minster to an ST and NAC (Sonia Gandhis position) should be given to an ST.
Goodbye Reservations
TAVLEEN SINGH | Thursday, May 25, 2006 10:27:11 IST It’s time for reservations to go altogether. Caste is not so important as it used to be... why are they doing this now?
On a very hot morning last week, at the height of the protests against Arjun Singh’s 27% quota, I drove from Baroda to a village called Naoli off the country road that goes to Anand. My purpose was to interview people who had benefited from the Amul milk cooperative but because there were medical students in the streets of Mumbai and Delhi protesting against the quotas for other backward caste (OBC) students I decided to use my visit to Naoli to also find out what people thought about reservations. It was just after 6.30 a.m. when I got to Naoli and men, women and young children were queued up in the Amul milk collection centre in the village square. They brought milk in stainless steel containers which after being weighed for fat content was poured into a chilling unit where it stayed till tankers arrived from Anand to collect it for Amul’s butter factory. The people in the queue looked well fed and well dressed and the women I had come to interview wore nice saris and gold jewellery. They said that if you had one buffalo it was possible to make over Rs 1000 a month out of the cooperative and they treated this as a side business which paid for household expenses. Having a cow or buffalo had the additional benefit, they said, of providing milk for the children of the family and they generally kept half for home use and sold the other half to the cooperative. The village square had a clock tower, a temple, a bust of Sardar Patel and a shop that sold a variety of goods from Cello gripper ballpoint pens and Head & Shoulders shampoo to Milan Multani mitti and Turbo cricket balls. There was an advertisement of Shahrukh Khan selling Pepsi cola in the square. In front of the bust of Sardar Patel I noticed a large heap of pipes that appeared to be part of some construction activity. When I asked what they were for the villagers said proudly that they were being installed to take ‘waste water’ out of their houses. Sanitation. This was one of the schemes of Narendra Modi’s government, they said, and they were happy with him as Chief Minister because according to them they had seen visible change in their lives after he came. ‘We have electricity for 24 hours a day, running water in our homes and all this has happened since Narendra Modi became chief minister. In Congress times there was never any work done’. As I was not certain if I had accidentally entered into conversation with a BJP political activist I changed the subject. As usually happens in villages a group of about twenty men had formed in the square and when I asked what they thought of Arjun Singh’s new reservations they said, ‘It’s time for reservations to go altogether. Caste is not so important as it used to be and in our village everybody sits and eats together so why are they doing this now?’
Identifying the OBCs ‘Which castes will benefit from this new 27% quota’ I asked. ‘Adivasis and Harijans’ they said. ‘They come in another category’ I said ‘there are already 22% seats in educational institutions reserved for them’. They looked puzzled, conferred amongst themselves for a moment and then told me that they did not have any other backward castes in the village. There must be castes, I persisted, who were considered backward like Yadavs in Northern India. Mulayam Singh and Laloo Yadav were backward caste leaders. This made them laugh. They thought I was joking. I spent an hour in the village asking people who the local backward castes were and could not find anyone who could identify them. Nearly everyone I spoke to said issues of caste did not interest them and what they were interested in was improving their lives and ensuring that their children lived even better. The milk producing ladies said that although they had benefited from being part of the Amul cooperative they did not want their children to go into this line of work. ‘Have we sent them to school and college for them to become milkmen?’ They said there were three high schools in the village and all the children these days went to school. Every household in the village had a TV set and there were at least fifty private cars. The only complaint the people of Naoli had was that they were not getting enough electricity for their fields. Unlike in the village where it was available 24 hours a day they got no more than seven or eight hours a day for agricultural purposes and often they did not know when it would come.
Government’s mixed signals Why have I gone to some lengths to tell you about Naoli village? To draw your attention, dear readers, to just how out of synch the political class is with rural realities. While rural Indians, wherever I go, want an improvement in their standard of living more than anything else we have politicians who want to fool them by raising issues of caste. Where the average rural Indian seeks from government basic necessities like electricity, drinking water, roads, schools and jobs we have a political class that is trying to cover up its grim failures in these areas by changing the subject. It has now been announced that the United Progressive Alliance government will go ahead with imposing a 27% quota for OBC students in central government institutions of higher learning from June 2007. If proof were needed that Arjun Singh had the backing of Sonia Gandhi when he made his move then this is it. The question we have a right to ask is why this cynical, disruptive step was taken at a time when the economy is doing better than ever and the idea of prosperity has taken root even in the villages. The day after I returned to Mumbai from Baroda the stock market fell by more than a thousand points. When I asked friends from the business world why this had happened they said it was on account of mixed signals from the government. That there was a circular from the Finance Ministry hinting at a capital gains tax and that Sitaram Yechury made a statement demanding this was only part of the problem, they said. The market gets affected by ‘sentiment’ and ‘atmospherics’ and the caste quotas have created a bad atmosphere. On its second anniversary the UPA government could not have done us a worse disservice.
Why did Child-Rapist C N Annadurai (former CM of Tamilnadu) go all the way to USA for medical treatment, and even there y did this mother-fucker depend on India born brahmin-doctors to get operated??
Why was dog/pig-fucker Murasoli Maran taken all the way to USA for medical treatments??
Will child-rapist/sister-fucker Arjun Singh build his own house with a civil engineer who has got 35% marks & passed!!
Sooner blind impotent bastard Karunanidhi is burnt alive when he's raping the Italian barmaid to death, better it is for the nation
Here is this guy who was born to a govt servant, became a doc because of reservation, owns a zen. This guy thinks all of India lived in Mumbai where all the people used toilets for all along 200 years. Further, the muslims didn't use toilets, it was only the Brahmins, who apparently never went near a river/pond/forest for their morning rituals. But for the Brahmins, this doc would be driving a zen since last 2000 years. Obviously he has to be thankless for his reserved seat.
At last, something positive on the defence front. India and Japan are getting closer militarily. Their navies are planning to conduct joint exercises and operations. This is really significant, as the Japanese Navy and the Indian Navy are the most powerful navies in their respective geographical areas, after the US Navy ofcourse.
Together, India and Japan can beat the crap out of the Chinese People's Liberation Army Navy(PLAN). link
Whatever may be the case guys, Congress has now officially transformed into a full-fledged Communal and Caste based party. Earlier, atleast it made a pretense of being secular and nationalist organisation. Under Sonia the Congress has achieved a new low. What has happened in last two years, the consequences of this will be felt for many years to come. No government in next 50 years will be able to clean up the mess. Similar to what happened when NDA came after 50 years of Congress rule. NDA just did not have the majic wand to cleanse it.
If elections are held in next two years this is my prediction
Congress alone : 240 seats. Communists : 80 seats Mulayam/Lalu et al : 150 seats BJP : 20 seats. Shiv Sena : 0
Kaunteya, I see no hope either. While you are at it, you may also assign different portfolios to the divinely-ordained members of Rahul Gandu's cabinet; Sachin Pilot, Milind Deora, Jyotiraditya Scindia, etc...
Kapidhwaja, the portfolio you have mentioned does not look bad at all. For one thing, they are all young. Secondly, Rahul Gandhi might not be as much of a proselytisation fan and might not have as much commitment to pope as the present congress cabinet has.
Of course, Hindus will have to pull up their socks to put enough pressure on the ministers. Personally, I think pilot-Scindia-Deora-Rahul combination is 100 times better than Bajpayee-Advani with their comuunist advisers and seeking-pat-from-seculars attitude.
IamForBJPBashing, this blog might not exactly support the BJP, but most of the readers here including myself are definitely anti-Kangress and do not relish the thought of sycophancy to the 'dynasty' or its various boot-licking jagirdars, whether they are young or not. They are still servile servants to Antonia Maino(or is it Marie Antoinette?) & Rahul Gandu. Get that straight into your thich head. There are plenty of other secular, syphantic Kangressi websites where you may spend your energies. If you haven't done it already, you may even do some boot-licking at the Kangress party and get rich soon. Please stop irritating us here.
I was just on the del.icio.us social bookmarking site, and I noticed that Dalit Freedom Network is suddenly springing up to spread the "truth" about the evils of Hinduism:
It's interesting that if someone makes a movie that's critical of Christianity or the Catholic Church in particular, then you'll see an avalanche of boos and snorts of disgust at the conspiracy mongering and "bigotry".
But when the Shylock myths about upper-caste conspiracies are peddled, then they are gobbled up with glee. It truly shows who has the power in the world today.
The website says: "The caste system, which has existed for more than 3,000 years, was developed by the Brahmins (priests) in order to maintain their superiority."
--- to maintain their superiority ? this website is propagating rubbish about brahmins and origin of caste system in India.
I ask them, how many dalits, 3000 years back OR now, wanted to or want to become vedic priests - do serious japa for hours together, sitting still in one place, studying/chanting vedas, etc? in those days it was all sruti-smriti. heard + remembered. no websites, no books, cassettes, dvd, ipod's.
for a brahmin, study was more important than food. they ate if they got any food when they asked. in the upanayanam ceremony a young brahmin learns to ask: "bhavathi bhikshandehi"
- mother, please give me alms.
all the preservation of vedic knowledge required people of sharp intellect, memory, brain-power and dedication. this was what being a brahmin was all about, contrary to all this talk of trying to "maintain superiority" since 3000 years.
and also, how many dalits were/are OK with not eating any meat ? brahmins were not allowed to, nor did they want to.
if the vedas survived for so many centuries, it is because of the inflexibility of the brahmin priest system. Today we have ISO 9001, Six-sigma, whatever, etc. In those days, the same thing was achieved through a rigid brahmanical system. They were a small community and something very valuable was preserved and kept up by them.
Today anyone buy it off the shelf.
at the end of it all, today, 21st century, the brahmin community is not affluent. and nor are they complaining. it seems to me that many brahmins do value the sacred much, much more than they value money - true to their dharma.
they have served a very important purpose for mankind. very few will understand this. but for them, most of india would have now been Xianised or Mhmedanised (one of them would have conquered the rest).
p.s. i will not be answering any comments criticising or challenging my post, or any trolls, as i do not want to debate on this. _
Daisies, presently, it is counterproductive to talk about anything caste-centric. The prevailing attitude was well expressed by one Tamil politician long back when he said if he saw a snake and a brahmin, he would kill the brahmin first. Interestingly, we know much more about the utility of snakes these days, because various people have studied snakes in the meantime. Studying brahmins is a crime, because Majority believes it is so. The hatred about certain upper-castes has been systematically fanned, just like they fan Hindu-hatred in Pakistan by teaching children that Hindus were bad.
For my part, I would like a law to be enacted that says abusing anyone based on any caste reference basis is a cognisable offence!! It is simple, nobody can dispute it is the right thing. BJP could have brought this ordinance. They failed to think about stopping this divisive hatred. The root cause of today's trouble is not congress, it is BJP.
Kapidhwaja, you do not own the blogosphere. Instead of typing abuses, try answering some of the questions that point towards BJP's inaction. If you have any living cell left in your brain, for once, think!
"IamAMoron", try doing some thinking yourself. Go to a Kangress 'Shibir' training camp and do some chamcha-giri there. Have you done Rajeev's bidding at all? If not scoot from here for good.
kapidhwaja, we all know that no party is perfect. The BJP is far from what all of us thought it would be. Part of it may be from the fact that they had to make do witht he resources they had. But Iamfordemocracy has a few valid points. He has asked a few pertinent questions. Of course, you are not duty bound to answer him but I believe he has a right to point out faults. One good way to improve one's society is to find faults and then find solutions to those issues. Perhaps, Iamfor... is trying to do such a thing. Please dont behave like some people who jump in and defend Brahmins whenever they are mentioned and then write ashort discalimer/footnote at the end saying they wont be answering any criticism to their posts. I wonder if it would be better for such people to not post. What is the point in commenting if the aim to turn a deaf ear to everyone else!! This, after writing lengthy homilies themselves
BTW, being a so called "upper caste" myself, I have no problem in accepting that Brahmins misused their authority and power. However noble and thoughtful the caste system was at one point of time, Brahmins were instrumental in bringing rigidty to the system at a later point of time. This doesnt mean that Brahmins today are insistent on continuing with the same rigidity. But accepting past mistakes isnt so bad. It doesnt mean we submit to what the foreign faiths want us to do.
You are back again to poke at me, arent you ? As I expected. You have score to settle with me.
Mister, Nowhere in my post did I ask anyone not to express their thoughts.
I simply stated that I will not be responding to any opinions challenging my opinion, as I do not want to debate. To do justice to the subject will involve a lengthy debate.
I did not ask anyone not to write what they want!! I am not the blog censorer. Whereas you are. You even feel Daisies OUGHT to think just like Parthasarathy!!
Alas, you prove again and again what a brainwashed bigot you are. The latest program running in your head is - "Attack daisies for whatever she writes, since P does agree with any of her views".
I dont have time to waste on bigots like you, and in future, if you write back like this, I will just copy paste this response, which will be my stock response to dear Parthasarathy.
Mr. Parthasarathy's comments are in good spirit and good taste. Let us hope everyone here (and on other similar blogs) posts with the intention of contributing to the debate than for any personal or ego purpose. We owe that to our Nation, to Hinuism, and to the freedom and independence of an indivitual.
Logically, your support for Parthasarathy's "good taste", effectively puts Daisies comments in bad taste, doesnt it ? He has explicitly stated that I ought to be responding to all comments challenging my post, and you support him in that, indirectly.
I guess you are in the same boat, who thinks that every question YOU raise here OUGHT to be answered by someone. In your case, your BJP questions. If no one answers, you continue to bash BJP, even on a totally unrelated matter.
Even my post became a BJP bashing point for you. I guess Rajeev was right after all, in naming you "ItsBjpsfault".
Heck, I'll leave him to come back and deal with you. Obelix can deal with you.
No daisies, you got me wrong. I sense you have a genuine concern for Hinduism and all the good things it incorporates. We love you for that!
Just a simple request to you, do post whenever you feel you are contributing (even if it means bashing me or someone else), but if it is just a personal issue, sonsider twice whether it is worth posting it. At least, that is what I try to do..(not that I always succeed).
Sorry, Iamfordemocracy your response does not gel with me.
Personal issue ? My post was on behalf of a whole community that has been maligned in the wesbite san posted.
So it was CLEARLY NOT a personal issue. You had no business to post a BJP distraction right there. Especially when YOU asked San NOT to post Off-Topic comments. What makes you think your comments are all On-Topic ?
Pls. dont post yr. BJP distractions when someone else makes meaningful comment that deserves attention.
Do not use this blog as YOUR OWN PERSONAL BJP bashing space. Create another blog (you already have one) and let people know you have a blog totally dedicated to that. If they are interested, they will come there. If not, they will not come.
No need to try to usurp THIS blog and the readers' time and attention here for your one-track BJP bashing needs.
Daisies, Once again, you have asked IamFor... to keep his BJP bashing to himself but you yourselves find it a non-issue that you continue to defend Brahmins and Brahmin community to the point thatt you sound boring. You have, in one blanket statement asserted that whatever Brahmins did, using their rigid policies was for the betterment of the society. To me, that is nothing but a lame effort to defend what you consider to be your own. The rigidity of the caste system (most of which I will lay blame on the upper castes, includng my own ancestors) is one of the reasons why Hindus keep fighting with each other. Rather than addressing those issues, you keep trying to paint a fairy tale picture of Brahmins reciting Vedic verses into their children's ears (lest a shudra nearby overheard it). You also say that Brahmins dont give as much importance to money as to the sacred scriptures. Perhaps!! But I can point to you a huge number of Brahmins, settled here in the US, including yours truly who have had no problem in choosing alien surroundings and to live amidst foreigners because their priority was not what you think it is. All I want to state here is that no one can generalize/stereotype people from a community. So, before you applaud yourself by calling your comments meaningful, yet completely admonishing others for their concerns, it might be better to look inward. The hypocrisy is unbearable.
P: "Daisies, Once again, you have asked IamFor... to keep his BJP bashing to himself but you yourselves find it a non-issue that you continue to defend Brahmins and Brahmin community to the point thatt you sound boring."
--- I never once complained on this blog about IamforD's BJP bashing in the past. I always respected his right to say whatever he wanted.
But this time, above, he pontificated to me.
So I reminded him of these:
1. His comments being off-topic when he has asked San not to be off-topic - DOUBLE STANDARDS.
2. His using this blog for BJP bashing, and yet complaining about my posts being "personal". --- DOUBLE STANDARDS.
The difference between my posts on brahmins is that I responded to Brahmin bashing, to a post by another blogger, who had the same views - that upper castes were being accused of consipracies.
Whereas IamforD INITIATES BJP bashing whenever he can.
Too bad you find my posts boring. What is boring for you may not be broing for someone else.
AND YOU ARE THE GREATEST HYPOCRITE. You never bashed San for posting his post (which started this thread), but are busy bashing Daisies. (not that I am asking anyone to bash San, I am simply showing you your hypocrisy).
Daisies doesnt care if dear P found her posts boring. Cant you just skip my posts and look for something else to read ?
kauntenya, Your election analysis looked very fuzzy math to me. 1) In Gujarath itself BJP will win 20 seats. You have excluded other states where BJP is strong. Jharkhand, Orissa, Madhyapradesh, Rajasthan, Karnataka, Maharashtra, Uttaranchal, Punjab, Himachal Pradesh, Bihar and importantly Uttar Pradesh and states like Assam .
2) As Mandal 1 was climaxing(1990) dynasty's slave Mani Shankar Aiyer was singing paens of Rajeev Gandhi in M.J.Akbar's Sunday until a top confidential opinion poll conducted by Prannoy Roy and ORG Group gave this survey result after BJP withdrew support to V.P.Singh. 1) BJP (245) 2) Communists (50) 3) Telugu Desham (30) 4) Other regional parties(40) 5) VP's rump Janatha Dal(40) leaving Congress around 110 seats. It made Rajeev Gandhi and congress scared to death and made them prop up Chandrasekhar for 6 months. Mani Shankar Aiyar was waxing the return of golden age of Congress in one issue suddenly started writing about how rise of BJP was comparable to Hitler in Germany in 1930's due to Advani's Ratha yatra.
Back to current times, I hardly forsee congress touching 3 digits it they are stuck up with Mandal this time. My predictions for next elections are as follows. 1) BJP (210 With revival in UP ) 2) Allies like JD(U), Shiv Sena, Akali Dal, AGP 55 seats. 3) Communists (50 seats) 4) Regional parties like TDP, DMK, AIADMK and BSP, SP (120 seats). 5) Congress alone struggling to reach 80 seats.
you keep trying to paint a fairy tale picture of Brahmins reciting Vedic verses into their children's ears (lest a shudra nearby overheard it)
Parthasarathy, Even yours is a tale, an important dirty tell though. WHy would a person tell others in his ears about the stuff of aryans coming to India ? Couldn't he tale a better route ?
is one of the reasons why Hindus keep fighting with each other.
They fight because everyone was made to understand a different fairy (dirty) tale, and the people involved are the ones like ministers, social scintists.... They were shown to be fighting all along, they are supposed to fight for devlopment. They may fight till extintion of hinduism.
You also say that Brahmins dont give as much importance to money as to the sacred scriptures. Perhaps!! But I can point to you a huge number of Brahmins, settled here in the US, including yours truly who have had no problem in choosing alien surroundings and to live amidst foreigners because their priority was not what you think it is.
Part of it is because of the independence generation that went in a different way, you don't have to go to US... Look for N Ram, RS Sharma, lot of communist Bengali Brahmins...Agree, you got an important issue here, and this is quite a victory for secularism.
I didnt even read P's comments since I felt he wasnt worth my attention.
Now that Virat0 has copied some lines, I did read, from virat0. I always read what Virat writes.
Dear P -
The brahmins I am talking of are the ones who stayed Vedic. Not the teeny minority who made their own choices and are now BAD-mouthing the Brahmin community, and WORSE not even allowing others to say anything good about the vedic brahmins.
P thinks just because he and others made their own present choices, MY ancestors, and other such people, many of whom have been extremely sincere, deserve to be maligned on dalit websites. And Daisies should shut up, because P does not fit her description of brahmins.
"Brahmins reciting Vedic verses into their children's ears (lest a shudra nearby overheard it)."
I would like to see photographs of this happening, and also proof that this indeed was the intent of those "wicked whispering Brahmins".
Dear P has grown up on a steady diet of Max Mueller's and Witzel's fairy tales.
Today he sits in USA filing patents to protect his IP, so that no one will steal his prosperity. He doesnt want even to share his economic properity and IP freely with shudras.
On the other hand, the poor vedic brahmins only protetcted the Vedas from distortion, by their very strict rules, Thank God for that.
I also know that NO GURU will give knowledge randomly without systematic training. Why ? Because 1) distortion possibility. 2) A LITTLE KNOWLEDGE IS A DANGEROUS THING !!! (half knowledge can be worse than no knowledge!!!)
Pranayama done improperly can give spinal problems, headaches, what not. This is just ONE example.
I wont waste any more time on P. He doesnt deserve my time.
And anyway all he can understand is modern programming languages and chip design.
And is an EXPERT at selectively abusing just one blogger, out of this entire team of bloggers. Only ONE blogger became his target of abuse.
Shows me his deep INsincerity to values.
And that too, he has never contributed here, he only reads posts, and he feels entitled to complain about me and to preach to me.
Even high-tech USA has not taught him the importance of value-added contributions. He is just a whiner and complainer, with only ONE target on the blog.
Hope he will learn to be a positive contributor in future.
Daisies, I agree with your second post from below about the reasons why you tried to defend Brahmins (surprise, surprise! we agree). But please tell me honestly. During India's rich history, have Brahmins really been the humble Veda chanting, alms seeking people that you claim they are? I doubt it. That is my main reason of disagreement. Just because there is a need for Hindus to feel united today doesnt mean we all have to sweep past problems under the carpet and try to convince each other that all is well. The right approach will be to ignore the troublemakers who practise the Semitic religions and deal with our own problems ourselves.
---"Even yours is a tale, an important dirty tell though. WHy would a person tell others in his ears about the stuff of aryans coming to India ? Couldn't he tale a better route ?" I didnt understand. If you are saying that I believe in the Aryan Invasion/Migration theory, you are mistaken. Or if you think any of this is an introduction to convince you that reservations are the way to go, that is wrong too.
---"Part of it is because of the independence generation that went in a different way, you don't have to go to US... Look for N Ram, RS Sharma, lot of communist Bengali Brahmins...Agree, you got an important issue here, and this is quite a victory for secularism." Perhaps so. But do you consider N Ram as a Hindu? I dont.
---"I also know that NO GURU will give knowledge randomly without systematic training. Why ? Because 1) distortion possibility. 2) A LITTLE KNOWLEDGE IS A DANGEROUS THING !!! (half knowledge can be worse than no knowledge!!!)" I wish those were the reasons. But this is why I say that you try tp paint a fairy tale picture. Things were not as glossy as you make them sound, Daisies. If I was harsh to you, my apoliogies. I didnt mean to irritate you. But if you really claim that you are well versed with our culture, why is it that you cannot accept the mistakes we did in the past and correct them for the future generations?
Daisies, ou assume that my career deals with programming languages and chip design. No, I am a finance consultant, just so you know.
In my eyes, you are still a very uncultured person, just beginning to learn the ABC's of culture, principles and values. In USA, courtesy is highly valued. You did not even have that to begin with, when you wrote here from there.
In India we say - "Vidya without Vinayam is Vyartham" (Education without humility is waste).
I am glad to see change in your attitude and behaviour. But, one swallow does not make a summer.
So I decline to answer your questions, because you are not yet MERITORIOUS and DESERVING.
You have not earned my respect yet.
I wish you great growth. Maybe someday, some other blogger will answer your questions if he/she finds in you a deserving candidate.
I didnt understand. If you are saying that I believe in the Aryan Invasion/Migration theory, you are mistaken. Or if you think any of this is an introduction to convince you that reservations are the way to go, that is wrong too.
Nope, none of the above are the reasons...However I thought you burrowed widely used description , and its uses too as it is used alongside a manufactured image. The reason was not to sweep past anything, but to express that may be another great image be sweeped away by that cover. May be hindus had a place in the grand universe rather than being manipulated by little conspiracies of history and something called a brahmin.
If you say "something called a brahmin", then anyone can say "something called a hindu".
they care 2 hoots about the "greatness of hindus" and the "grand place of hindus in the universe", just like virat cares 2 hoots about the "thing" called brahmin.
for the western historians, hindu is just some stupid insignificant "thing".
whereas 'aryan' has a grand place in the universe.
If you say "something called a brahmin", then anyone can say "something called a hindu".
Sometimes even this much is considered too much to grant politically.
just like virat cares 2 hoots about the "thing" called brahmin.
I think 'thing' is what happened in secular analysis, they lost and settled for analyzing the objects . I pity such analysis and hope for better standards of govt paid analyssts. Considering such analysis is by the blind fellows, how many hoots would you or for that matter any sane person could care for ?
re: "I think 'thing' is what happened in secular analysis, they lost and settled for analyzing the objects . I pity such analysis and hope for better standards of govt paid analyssts. Considering such analysis is by the blind fellows, how many hoots would you or for that matter any sane person could care for ?"
- Virat, Your posts are mostly very hard to understand, almost cryptic, although I always read them and try to decipher, because your viewpoint seems very unique, usually. Not that I always agree with you, but it is unique.
I confess I could not understand a thing in the above lines. I tried my best.
Let me clarify my statement again - if any entity within hinduism is a "thing" for you, then Xists M-ists and Witzels will all be justified in calling hindus a "thing".
This is a logical conclusion, and I am surprised you are defending yourself so much against a very simple logical conclusion.
Madrasi_gult : Say it to Jayalalitha, She would try you in chennai Tourism office :) Also Ensure your office is at a safe distance from west mamblam boundary walls.
Daisies, It was/is not a thing for me, but it exists already.
"I am glad to see change in your attitude and behaviour. But, one swallow does not make a summer.
So I decline to answer your questions, because you are not yet MERITORIOUS and DESERVING."
Oh, I am so depressed and disappointed ever since I read this. I couldnt even sleep yesterday night. Daisies, please please answer my question. How could you do this to me? Please show some of that humility you just harped about. Do you remember my first post addressed to you? I mentioned that it was very easy to preach and very difficult to practise. You have just proved that in your posts ever since.
You came here and abused me starting from the first minute you stepped into this blog. You kept that up afterwards when you revisited.
I have merely stated that in my eyes, you are not yet meritorious and deserving, because one swallow does not make a summer. SIMPLY BECAUSE you wrote me ONE nice email after abusing me 20 times. That is why I said "One swallow does not make a summer". I was afraid you would have a relapse.
You have shown me exactly that - that you are NIT capable of more than one nice email to someone whom you sent 50 abusive posts, starting from your entry here.
You just proved me right - one swallow does not make a summer.
Nice record. And you still seem entitled to abuse me, after all this.
Prithviraj L. Parthasarathy may pretend to belong brahmin varna but his occupation (indicating his limited intelligence) suggests he belongs to shudra or perhaps vaishya varna.
To explain what is a brahmin, I would point to the example of the highly acclaimed mathematician Paul Erdos.
57 comments:
I had taken break from this blog for India visit. Also I was very disappointed with state election results which I thought would result in collapse of ulta pulta alliance(Assam changing hands, AIADMK returning power in Tamilnadu and DMK losing endangering UPA, Communists having just majority in Bengal, Hung assembly in Kerala with BJP making maiden entry in Manjeshwaram and Palghat). However
the way stock market is tanking, Aaaj ka Arjun's reservation drama and Madmohan' absolute surrender to US by not testing Agni3 my gut feeling is that snap polls are in October. After Mandal 1 VP's party came down from 3 digits(141 same as Sonia's congress) to 2 digits with most seats coming in from Bihar and few from UP due to Ajith Singh. If Mandal 2 happens same thing is going to happen to Sonias congress already absent from most of Indias major states.
A dud in the manger?
By Brahma Chellaney
May 22, 2006
Advertisement
Which state invests the bulk of its defence modernisation resources not on strengthening its own armament base or deterrent capabilities but on subsidising the military industrial complex of others? In which country do scientists confront political obstacles to the maturation of indigenous capabilities? Where have profligate arms imports become the main source of metastasising corruption?
The answer is India. If a three-year national moratorium were declared on the import of any new weapon system, it will help clean up politics and public discourse without compromising the defence of India. A net saving of at least $15 billion will also accrue. Note the oddity that at the very time the government is moving to import 126 medium combat aircraft (MCA), it has put on indefinite hold the maiden flight-test of the Agni 3 intermediate-range missile. Why the awkwardness to test an indigenous ballistic missile but the lack of political embarrassment to import high-priced warplanes? After all, an MCA and Agni 3 can carry out similar missions -- deliver a nuclear or conventional payload against an intended target.
Manned aircraft are militarily no less potent than ballistic missiles. They also rival missiles as pre-emption weapons. Yet the cost of acquiring, manufacturing and maintaining missiles is indubitably far less than that of strike aircraft.
The import of 126 fighters will cost between $ 7 billion and $ 9.2 billion with the full package, including onboard weaponry and advanced radar warning system. With the US expecting to clinch the deal, the cost range reflects the price differential between the obsolescent F-16s at the lower end and the technically troubled F/A-18s at the upper end. (The US is not offering India its latest F-35s, a project involving eight foreign partners.)
It might shock many to know that India’s cumulative investments in its missile capabilities total barely 5.6 per cent of what it will cost to buy the F-16s. The entire investment in the Integrated Guided Missile Development Programme (IGMDP) from its 1983 inception up to December 2005 aggregated Rs 1771.4 crore, or $ 389 million. Despite lagging behind its regional missile needs, India has, in the recently approved annual budget, earmarked for missile development only $ 20.6 million. The ubiquitous foreign arms dealers in town will turn up their noses at such a trifling amount.
Why the rush to import warplanes despite the diffidence to test an Agni 3? Allegations of kickbacks in the last mega-deal -- the $ 3.4-billion Scorpene submarine contract -- have yet to quieten down. Even if the issue of commissions was set aside, any independent investigations will reveal the dubious value of some of the arms contracts India has signed. Other than the Sukhoi-30 heavy combat aircraft (HCA) and the three early-warning Phalcon radar systems aboard Ilyushin-76 planes, what imported weapons give India the military edge it needs?
India may be poor, but its decision-makers are pretty generous in awarding arms contracts to foreign vendors. Like oil sheikhs, they are now signing import deals worth between $ 4 billion and $ 6 billion every year. This is not, mind you, due to ignorance of world history: no country has become a major military power through reliance on arms imports. Rather, the arms-import mania reflects a spreading rot in the system, as underlined by the Navy War Room leak case.
Ask yourself: will India be stronger with 126 new strike aircraft or, at a fraction of their cost, with 126 Agni 3s? If India were to buy the F/A-18s, the value of that single deal will surpass the country’s aggregate investments in the past decade in defence research and development, including strategic systems — nuclear and missile. By the levels of OECD nations and China, India’s defence R&D spending is abysmally low. China spends 28 per cent of its huge military budget on R&D and an extra 5 per cent just on missiles. India together spends 6.1 per cent of its defence outlays on R&D and missiles.
Is it thus any surprise that the import lobbies in New Delhi are so strong? Or that India has shelved the Agni 3 while it pursues the strike-aircraft purchase? Helping Britain safeguard 5,000 jobs, including 2,200 at Brough, East Yorkshire, India awarded a $ 1.9 billion contract to BAE Systems for the out-of-date Hawk jet trainer. But the total DRDO budget for the current year is just 63 per cent of that -- $ 1.19 billion. Out of this, 35 per cent, or a meagre $ 419 million, will go toward developing capabilities at the core of India’s future: nuclear, missile and nuclear-submarine systems.
A country should defend itself largely with the armaments it can produce, not with the pricey imported toys its forces may want. If this tenet were to dictate policy, India could greatly boost its manufacturing capabilities and create tens of thousands of jobs at home through a vibrant military industrial complex. From being the world’s largest arms importer, India would emerge as a worthy exporter. Given that India has not fought a full-fledged war in 35 years and is unlikely to face full-scale aggression in the next decade, it is possible to implement in stages such a principle.
In this light, the Agni 3 test freeze is troubling. India’s primary focus ought to be on preventing aggression through indigenous deterrent assets, not on seeking to defeat aggression with extravagant weapons from abroad. Yet the PM has acted quite the reverse — from accepting nuclear-capability limits under a misbegotten deal with the US to providing assurances on multibillion-dollar imports of US arms and reactors. The Agni 3 test freeze epitomises the mounting costs of the nuclear deal. In fact, in the period since Rajiv Gandhi conducted the first Agni test exactly 17 years ago, the Agni programme has been significantly crimped by a succession of weak, vacillating PMs.
A solid-fuelled system with an advanced flex nozzle, the Agni 3 has a twice-bigger motor and 50 per cent larger payload capacity than Agni 2. Pranab Mukherjee has cited ‘a self-imposed restraint’ to rationalise the test hold-up. India has not tested a ballistic missile since August 2004. In that period, China has aggressively pushed ahead with its new DF-31 and DF-41 ICBMs and Pakistan has carried out multiple tests of Chinese-origin missiles, including three tests in the past three months -- the Shaheen 2 (an ostensible match to Agni 2), Babur cruise missile and Abdali short-range missile. India’s own assessment shows it has fallen behind even Pakistan on missiles, with Islamabad having assembled and deployed in underground silos almost 100 Shaheen 1s and about 20 to 24 of Shaheen 2s.
Mukherjee claims “we want to keep our international commitments on non-proliferation”. Who will enlighten the illustrious defence minister that there is no missile non-proliferation regime in existence and India thus could not have made ‘international commitments’? The MTCR is neither an international agreement nor a treaty but an informal and voluntary technology-control arrangement among some nations. If he is alluding to some secret commitments to the US, how do they become ‘international’ in nature?
It is easy to figure out why the US wishes to stall the dirt-cheap Agni 3 while it aggressively moves to sell expensive strike aircraft to India. By deciding to sell dozens of F-16s to Pakistan, it is creating and exploiting an Indian need to import fighters. The best CBM India and Pakistan can agree to -- a CBM that will yield a true and lasting peace dividend -- is to forego purchase of new fighters and open a regular dialogue on observing arms-import restraints. This is a CBM the merchants of death will seek to scuttle.
The Agni 3 test freeze, in effect since January when the missile became ready, will last months more. Having missed the May deadline, the next opening to test will come only in September after the monsoons. But the nuclear-deal saga is unlikely to be over by then. The PM’s freeze actually does a disservice to the deal he is obsessed with. A test would have sent a clear message that India is going to have a deterrent force and, like it or not, the US can either accept that reality in partnership with India or counter-productively oppose it. Didn’t the 1998 nuclear tests lead the US to court India?
Here's an article about the Nehru-Gandhi family's own little privy purses in the domain of school admissions:
http://desicritics.org/2006/05/20/090806.php
Yet another example of the hypocritical values of the dynasty clan and their personal party. But certainly one worth reading in light of current events.
Let us make a promise to our country
http://indiansforequality.blogspot.com/
A powerful idea is mightier than the sword. Look at how Gujarat is handling the aggressive Amir Khan. His new picture won't be screened in multiplexes in Gujarat. His producer is on knees...
Let us note that every person has a voice .. he should know how to make it heard. He can choose to be shrill and maniac, like Arundhati Roy and Medha Patkar, or he can use a purposeful and firm voice.
I hope those who are against reservations think of their power. Choose a channel! That is all you need to do, and talk in one voice.
More about this later.
An article by Francois Gautier in rediff. Shatters the myth of Brahminical domination and affluence.
Are Brahmins the Dalits of today?
Timely article by Francois
I guess the community is so fractured and weak that one doesn;t even hear much voices of protest.. most of the some-what powrful among the brahmins aare anyway in the US . Some are in politics and they would keep their lips sealed for fear of losing political career
I think it is important to expose the real people behind the reservation, and the real people behind the reservation is not arjun singh. Arjun Singh is a small time politician who has sensed where he has better oppurtinity for becoming grand.
In my opinion reservation is less harmful, if the real mafia and their reasons of hate are mentioned. If not this mafia would spread to enslave more people.
Getting sympathy from the mafia is a no no for all, especially those who have more info. Thats what the mafia wants, to purchase people by giving them jobs and economic benifits.
The govt is smart - now it says to buy more people of one caste by giving reservation, by people of another caste by increasing seats. Let none be purchased.
Have a look @ the image of the Italian Barmaid (IB) and her lap-dogs --the dumb Sardar and the senile old-fart Arjun Singh -- cut-outs of whom are propped up @ AIIMS campus in Delhi, on Rediff:
http://www.rediff.com/news/2006/may/24look1.htm
The IB keeping her 'pets' on the leash ---the title seems to be misleading with whats being witnessed all-around in India --one wonder's how or Is it that these morons and inbeciles are just doing their mistress bidding...
IF any of you guys can point out as to how to post that image here, the way sometimes you embed hyper-links in your posts (no knowledge as to how you do it), that'd be fine, 'coz I think with the way Rediff has gradually become a Congi mouthpiece, that image won't be there for long...
We Indians sure know how to shoot ourselves in the foot, and at this time when the world is watching in awe and should say jealousy, as to how India has carved out a place for itself in knowledge sphere, thanx to the divisionary tactics of these nincompoop politicians, we sure will be back to where we started from and the world will again steal a march over us... a sense of deja-vu all over again!
Wonder, how long its gonna be before the avg. Indian voter wakes up and shows these gutter-level creatures that all these old policies of divide-and-rule no longer work.... but hey whom am I talking to... these morons (the voters for a change in this case) who returned the commies and the pinkos back to power in Waste Bengal and Kerala --- they sure prove that old adage true:
You get what you deserve!
NRI woman claims she is Jesus:
http://www.siliconindia.com/shownewsdata.asp?newsno=31964&newscat=Top
Protests soon to follow. :P
Another good article by Tavleen Singh. How do we help medicos on non cooperation movement. Here is few of my ideas.
1) Start withdrawing money from Public sector banks. If everybody starts doing it (Even if 3% of people start withdrawing) and start shifting to private banks there will be massive panic.
2) Since stock market has already fallen why not ask every person to withdraw and tell sell orders to brokerage. If stock market falls the first casuality will be Chidambaram and next UPA govt.
3) Ask UPA to practise what it preaches. HRD minister should be given to a OBC. Finance minster to an ST and NAC (Sonia Gandhis position) should be given to an ST.
Goodbye Reservations
TAVLEEN SINGH | Thursday, May 25, 2006 10:27:11 IST
It’s time for reservations to go altogether. Caste is not so important as it used to be... why are they doing this now?
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for :
On a very hot morning last week, at the height of the protests against Arjun Singh’s 27% quota, I drove from Baroda to a village called Naoli off the country road that goes to Anand. My purpose was to interview people who had benefited from the Amul milk cooperative but because there were medical students in the streets of Mumbai and Delhi protesting against the quotas for other backward caste (OBC) students I decided to use my visit to Naoli to also find out what people thought about reservations.
It was just after 6.30 a.m. when I got to Naoli and men, women and young children were queued up in the Amul milk collection centre in the village square. They brought milk in stainless steel containers which after being weighed for fat content was poured into a chilling unit where it stayed till tankers arrived from Anand to collect it for Amul’s butter factory. The people in the queue looked well fed and well dressed and the women I had come to interview wore nice saris and gold jewellery. They said that if you had one buffalo it was possible to make over Rs 1000 a month out of the cooperative and they treated this as a side business which paid for household expenses. Having a cow or buffalo had the additional benefit, they said, of providing milk for the children of the family and they generally kept half for home use and sold the other half to the cooperative.
The village square had a clock tower, a temple, a bust of Sardar Patel and a shop that sold a variety of goods from Cello gripper ballpoint pens and Head & Shoulders shampoo to Milan Multani mitti and Turbo cricket balls. There was an advertisement of Shahrukh Khan selling Pepsi cola in the square. In front of the bust of Sardar Patel I noticed a large heap of pipes that appeared to be part of some construction activity. When I asked what they were for the villagers said proudly that they were being installed to take ‘waste water’ out of their houses. Sanitation. This was one of the schemes of Narendra Modi’s government, they said, and they were happy with him as Chief Minister because according to them they had seen visible change in their lives after he came.
‘We have electricity for 24 hours a day, running water in our homes and all this has
happened since Narendra Modi became chief minister. In Congress times there was never any work done’.
As I was not certain if I had accidentally entered into conversation with a BJP political activist I changed the subject. As usually happens in villages a group of about twenty men had formed in the square and when I asked what they thought of Arjun Singh’s new reservations they said, ‘It’s time for reservations to go altogether. Caste is not so important as it used to be and in our village everybody sits and eats together so why are they doing this now?’
Identifying the OBCs
‘Which castes will benefit from this new 27% quota’ I asked.
‘Adivasis and Harijans’ they said.
‘They come in another category’ I said ‘there are already 22% seats in educational institutions reserved for them’.
They looked puzzled, conferred amongst themselves for a moment and then told me that they did not have any other backward castes in the village. There must be castes, I persisted, who were considered backward like Yadavs in Northern India. Mulayam Singh and Laloo Yadav were backward caste leaders. This made them laugh. They thought I was joking. I spent an hour in the village asking people who the local backward castes were and could not find anyone who could identify them.
Nearly everyone I spoke to said issues of caste did not interest them and what they were interested in was improving their lives and ensuring that their children lived even better. The milk producing ladies said that although they had benefited from being part of the Amul cooperative they did not want their children to go into this line of work. ‘Have we sent them to school and college for them to become milkmen?’
They said there were three high schools in the village and all the children these days went to school. Every household in the village had a TV set and there were at least fifty private cars. The only complaint the people of Naoli had was that they were not getting enough electricity for their fields. Unlike in the village where it was available 24 hours a day they got no more than seven
or eight hours a day for agricultural purposes and often they did not know when it would come.
Government’s mixed signals
Why have I gone to some lengths to tell you about Naoli village? To draw your attention, dear readers, to just how out of synch the political class is with rural realities. While rural Indians, wherever I go, want an improvement in their standard of living more than anything else we have politicians who want to fool them by raising issues of caste. Where the average rural Indian seeks from government basic necessities like electricity, drinking water, roads, schools and jobs we have a political class that is trying to cover up its grim failures in these areas by changing the subject.
It has now been announced that the United Progressive Alliance government will go ahead with imposing a 27% quota for OBC students in central government institutions of higher learning from June 2007. If proof were needed that Arjun Singh had the backing of Sonia Gandhi when he
made his move then this is it. The question we have a right to ask is why this cynical,
disruptive step was taken at a time when the economy is doing better than ever and the idea of prosperity has taken root even in the villages.
The day after I returned to Mumbai from Baroda the stock market fell by more than a thousand points. When I asked friends from the business world why this had happened they said it was on account of mixed signals from the government. That there was a circular from the Finance Ministry hinting at a capital gains tax and that Sitaram Yechury made a statement demanding this was only part of the problem, they said. The market gets affected by ‘sentiment’ and ‘atmospherics’ and the caste quotas have created a bad atmosphere. On its second anniversary the UPA government could not have done us a worse disservice.
Good one IndianPatriot. Here is another article abt reservations by Subhash Kak.
The Next Partition of India
'Moderate Islamic' Malaysia is at it again...Temples Demolished in Malaysia
Why did Child-Rapist C N Annadurai (former CM of Tamilnadu) go all the way to USA for medical treatment, and even there y did this mother-fucker depend on India born brahmin-doctors to get operated??
Why was dog/pig-fucker Murasoli Maran taken all the way to USA for medical treatments??
Will child-rapist/sister-fucker Arjun Singh build his own house with a civil engineer who has got 35% marks & passed!!
Sooner blind impotent bastard Karunanidhi is burnt alive when he's raping the Italian barmaid to death, better it is for the nation
Here is this guy who was born to a govt servant, became a doc because of reservation, owns a zen. This guy thinks all of India lived in Mumbai where all the people used toilets for all along 200 years. Further, the muslims didn't use toilets, it was only the Brahmins, who apparently never went near a river/pond/forest for their morning rituals. But for the Brahmins, this doc would be driving a zen since last 2000 years. Obviously he has to be thankless for his reserved seat.
http://in.rediff.com/news/2006/may/26spec1.htm
At last, something positive on the defence front. India and Japan are getting closer militarily. Their navies are planning to conduct joint exercises and operations. This is really significant, as the Japanese Navy and the Indian Navy are the most powerful navies in their respective geographical areas, after the US Navy ofcourse.
Together, India and Japan can beat the crap out of the Chinese People's Liberation Army Navy(PLAN).
link
Whatever may be the case guys, Congress has now officially transformed into a full-fledged Communal and Caste based party. Earlier, atleast it made a pretense of being secular and nationalist organisation. Under Sonia the Congress has achieved a new low. What has happened in last two years, the consequences of this will be felt for many years to come. No government in next 50 years will be able to clean up the mess. Similar to what happened when NDA came after 50 years of Congress rule. NDA just did not have the majic wand to cleanse it.
If elections are held in next two years this is my prediction
Congress alone : 240 seats.
Communists : 80 seats
Mulayam/Lalu et al : 150 seats
BJP : 20 seats.
Shiv Sena : 0
Rahul Gandhi = PM.
Bottom line. It's a lost cause.
NRI's are pitching in and giving monetary support to the anti-quota stir.
link
Here is something inspiring... Tea stall owner's son clears IAS exam
Rahul Gandhi = PM
Kaunteya, I see no hope either. While you are at it, you may also assign different portfolios to the divinely-ordained members of Rahul Gandu's cabinet; Sachin Pilot, Milind Deora, Jyotiraditya Scindia, etc...
Kapidhwaja, the portfolio you have mentioned does not look bad at all. For one thing, they are all young. Secondly, Rahul Gandhi might not be as much of a proselytisation fan and might not have as much commitment to pope as the present congress cabinet has.
Of course, Hindus will have to pull up their socks to put enough pressure on the ministers. Personally, I think pilot-Scindia-Deora-Rahul combination is 100 times better than Bajpayee-Advani with their comuunist advisers and seeking-pat-from-seculars attitude.
dear shadow warrior
could u pls look in to my blog at, once you are back of course!
http://alalalai.blogspot.com/
Surya
IamForBJPBashing, this blog might not exactly support the BJP, but most of the readers here including myself are definitely anti-Kangress and do not relish the thought of sycophancy to the 'dynasty' or its various boot-licking jagirdars, whether they are young or not. They are still servile servants to Antonia Maino(or is it Marie Antoinette?) & Rahul Gandu. Get that straight into your thich head. There are plenty of other secular, syphantic Kangressi websites where you may spend your energies. If you haven't done it already, you may even do some boot-licking at the Kangress party and get rich soon. Please stop irritating us here.
I was just on the del.icio.us social bookmarking site, and I noticed that Dalit Freedom Network is suddenly springing up to spread the "truth" about the evils of Hinduism:
http://www.dalitnetwork.org/
It's interesting that if someone makes a movie that's critical of Christianity or the Catholic Church in particular, then you'll see an avalanche of boos and snorts of disgust at the conspiracy mongering and "bigotry".
But when the Shylock myths about upper-caste conspiracies are peddled, then they are gobbled up with glee. It truly shows who has the power in the world today.
The website says:
"The caste system, which has existed for more than 3,000 years, was developed by the Brahmins (priests) in order to maintain their superiority."
--- to maintain their superiority ? this website is propagating
rubbish about brahmins and origin of caste system in India.
I ask them, how many dalits, 3000 years back OR now, wanted
to or want to become vedic priests - do serious japa for
hours together, sitting still in one place, studying/chanting
vedas, etc? in those days it was all sruti-smriti. heard +
remembered. no websites, no books, cassettes, dvd, ipod's.
for a brahmin, study was more important than food. they ate
if they got any food when they asked. in the upanayanam
ceremony a young brahmin learns to ask:
"bhavathi bhikshandehi"
- mother, please give me alms.
all the preservation of vedic knowledge required people of
sharp intellect, memory, brain-power and dedication. this was
what being a brahmin was all about, contrary to all this
talk of trying to "maintain superiority" since 3000 years.
and also, how many dalits were/are OK with not eating any meat ?
brahmins were not allowed to, nor did they want to.
if the vedas survived for so many centuries, it is because of the
inflexibility of the brahmin priest system. Today we have
ISO 9001, Six-sigma, whatever, etc. In those days, the same thing
was achieved through a rigid brahmanical system. They were a small
community and something very valuable was preserved and kept up by
them.
Today anyone buy it off the shelf.
at the end of it all, today, 21st century, the brahmin community is
not affluent. and nor are they complaining. it seems to me that
many brahmins do value the sacred much, much more than they value
money - true to their dharma.
they have served a very important purpose for mankind. very few will
understand this. but for them, most of india would have now been
Xianised or Mhmedanised (one of them would have conquered the rest).
p.s. i will not be answering any comments criticising or challenging
my post, or any trolls, as i do not want to debate on this.
_
Daisies, presently, it is counterproductive to talk about anything caste-centric. The prevailing attitude was well expressed by one Tamil politician long back when he said if he saw a snake and a brahmin, he would kill the brahmin first. Interestingly, we know much more about the utility of snakes these days, because various people have studied snakes in the meantime. Studying brahmins is a crime, because Majority believes it is so. The hatred about certain upper-castes has been systematically fanned, just like they fan Hindu-hatred in Pakistan by teaching children that Hindus were bad.
For my part, I would like a law to be enacted that says abusing anyone based on any caste reference basis is a cognisable offence!! It is simple, nobody can dispute it is the right thing. BJP could have brought this ordinance. They failed to think about stopping this divisive hatred. The root cause of today's trouble is not congress, it is BJP.
"IamAMoron", yeah right, its the BJP's fault that you are not shutting-up.
Kapidhwaja, you do not own the blogosphere. Instead of typing abuses, try answering some of the questions that point towards BJP's inaction. If you have any living cell left in your brain, for once, think!
"IamAMoron", try doing some thinking yourself. Go to a Kangress 'Shibir' training camp and do some chamcha-giri there. Have you done Rajeev's bidding at all? If not scoot from here for good.
kapidhwaja, we all know that no party is perfect. The BJP is far from what all of us thought it would be. Part of it may be from the fact that they had to make do witht he resources they had. But Iamfordemocracy has a few valid points. He has asked a few pertinent questions. Of course, you are not duty bound to answer him but I believe he has a right to point out faults. One good way to improve one's society is to find faults and then find solutions to those issues. Perhaps, Iamfor... is trying to do such a thing.
Please dont behave like some people who jump in and defend Brahmins whenever they are mentioned and then write ashort discalimer/footnote at the end saying they wont be answering any criticism to their posts. I wonder if it would be better for such people to not post. What is the point in commenting if the aim to turn a deaf ear to everyone else!! This, after writing lengthy homilies themselves
BTW, being a so called "upper caste" myself, I have no problem in accepting that Brahmins misused their authority and power. However noble and thoughtful the caste system was at one point of time, Brahmins were instrumental in bringing rigidty to the system at a later point of time. This doesnt mean that Brahmins today are insistent on continuing with the same rigidity. But accepting past mistakes isnt so bad. It doesnt mean we submit to what the foreign faiths want us to do.
Dear, dear Parthasarathy,
You are back again to poke at me,
arent you ? As I expected. You have
score to settle with me.
Mister, Nowhere in my post did I ask anyone not to express their
thoughts.
I simply stated that I will not
be responding to any opinions
challenging my opinion, as I do
not want to debate. To do justice
to the subject will involve a
lengthy debate.
I did not ask anyone not to write
what they want!! I am not the
blog censorer. Whereas you are. You
even feel Daisies OUGHT to think
just like Parthasarathy!!
Alas, you prove again and again
what a brainwashed bigot you are.
The latest program running in your
head is - "Attack daisies for
whatever she writes, since P does
agree with any of her views".
I dont have time to waste on
bigots like you, and in future,
if you write back like this, I
will just copy paste this response,
which will be my stock response to
dear Parthasarathy.
_
Mr. Parthasarathy's comments are in good spirit and good taste. Let us hope everyone here (and on other similar blogs) posts with the intention of contributing to the debate than for any personal or ego purpose. We owe that to our Nation, to Hinuism, and to the freedom and independence of an indivitual.
Iamfordemocracy,
Logically, your support for
Parthasarathy's "good taste",
effectively puts Daisies comments
in bad taste, doesnt it ? He has
explicitly stated that I ought to
be responding to all comments
challenging my post, and you
support him in that, indirectly.
I guess you are in the same boat,
who thinks that every question
YOU raise here OUGHT to be
answered by someone. In your
case, your BJP questions. If no
one answers, you continue to bash
BJP, even on a totally unrelated
matter.
Even my post became a BJP bashing
point for you. I guess Rajeev was
right after all, in naming
you "ItsBjpsfault".
Heck, I'll leave him to come back
and deal with you. Obelix can deal
with you.
_
No daisies, you got me wrong. I sense you have a genuine concern for Hinduism and all the good things it incorporates. We love you for that!
Just a simple request to you, do post whenever you feel you are contributing (even if it means bashing me or someone else), but if it is just a personal issue, sonsider twice whether it is worth posting it. At least, that is what I try to do..(not that I always succeed).
Sorry, Iamfordemocracy your
response does not gel with me.
Personal issue ? My post was on
behalf of a whole community that
has been maligned in the wesbite
san posted.
So it was CLEARLY NOT a personal
issue. You had no business to post a BJP distraction right there. Especially when YOU asked San NOT
to post Off-Topic comments. What makes you think your comments are
all On-Topic ?
Pls. dont post yr. BJP distractions
when someone else makes meaningful
comment that deserves attention.
Do not use this blog as YOUR OWN
PERSONAL BJP bashing space. Create
another blog (you already have one)
and let people know you have a blog
totally dedicated to that. If they
are interested, they will come
there. If not, they will not come.
No need to try to usurp THIS
blog and the readers' time and
attention here for your one-track
BJP bashing needs.
_
Daisies,
Once again, you have asked IamFor... to keep his BJP bashing to himself but you yourselves find it a non-issue that you continue to defend Brahmins and Brahmin community to the point thatt you sound boring. You have, in one blanket statement asserted that whatever Brahmins did, using their rigid policies was for the betterment of the society. To me, that is nothing but a lame effort to defend what you consider to be your own. The rigidity of the caste system (most of which I will lay blame on the upper castes, includng my own ancestors) is one of the reasons why Hindus keep fighting with each other. Rather than addressing those issues, you keep trying to paint a fairy tale picture of Brahmins reciting Vedic verses into their children's ears (lest a shudra nearby overheard it). You also say that Brahmins dont give as much importance to money as to the sacred scriptures. Perhaps!! But I can point to you a huge number of Brahmins, settled here in the US, including yours truly who have had no problem in choosing alien surroundings and to live amidst foreigners because their priority was not what you think it is. All I want to state here is that no one can generalize/stereotype people from a community.
So, before you applaud yourself by calling your comments meaningful, yet completely admonishing others for their concerns, it might be better to look inward. The hypocrisy is unbearable.
P:
"Daisies,
Once again, you have asked IamFor... to keep his BJP bashing to himself but you yourselves find it a non-issue that you continue to defend Brahmins and Brahmin community to the point thatt you sound boring."
--- I never once complained on this
blog about IamforD's BJP
bashing in the past. I always
respected his right to say
whatever he wanted.
But this time, above, he
pontificated to me.
So I reminded him of these:
1. His comments being off-topic
when he has asked San not to be
off-topic - DOUBLE STANDARDS.
2. His using this blog for BJP
bashing, and yet complaining
about my posts being "personal".
--- DOUBLE STANDARDS.
The difference between my posts on
brahmins is that I responded to
Brahmin bashing, to a post by
another blogger, who had the same
views - that upper castes were
being accused of consipracies.
Whereas IamforD INITIATES BJP
bashing whenever he can.
Too bad you find my posts boring.
What is boring for you may not be
broing for someone else.
AND YOU ARE THE GREATEST HYPOCRITE.
You never bashed San for posting
his post (which started this thread), but are busy bashing
Daisies. (not that I am asking
anyone to bash San, I am simply
showing you your hypocrisy).
Daisies doesnt care if dear P
found her posts boring. Cant you
just skip my posts and look for
something else to read ?
_
kauntenya,
Your election analysis looked very fuzzy math to me.
1) In Gujarath itself BJP will win 20 seats. You have excluded other states where BJP is strong. Jharkhand, Orissa, Madhyapradesh, Rajasthan, Karnataka, Maharashtra, Uttaranchal, Punjab, Himachal Pradesh, Bihar and importantly Uttar Pradesh and states like Assam .
2) As Mandal 1 was climaxing(1990) dynasty's slave Mani Shankar Aiyer was singing paens of Rajeev Gandhi in M.J.Akbar's Sunday until a top confidential opinion poll conducted by Prannoy Roy and ORG Group gave this survey result after BJP withdrew support to V.P.Singh.
1) BJP (245)
2) Communists (50)
3) Telugu Desham (30)
4) Other regional parties(40)
5) VP's rump Janatha Dal(40)
leaving Congress around 110 seats.
It made Rajeev Gandhi and congress scared to death and made them prop up Chandrasekhar for 6 months.
Mani Shankar Aiyar was waxing the return of golden age of Congress in one issue suddenly started writing about how rise of BJP was comparable to Hitler in Germany in 1930's due to Advani's Ratha yatra.
Back to current times, I hardly forsee congress touching 3 digits it they are stuck up with Mandal this time. My predictions for next elections are as follows.
1) BJP (210 With revival in UP )
2) Allies like JD(U), Shiv Sena, Akali Dal, AGP 55 seats.
3) Communists (50 seats)
4) Regional parties like TDP, DMK, AIADMK and BSP, SP (120 seats).
5) Congress alone struggling to reach 80 seats.
Let us see who will come right.
you keep trying to paint a fairy tale picture of Brahmins reciting Vedic verses into their children's ears (lest a shudra nearby overheard it)
Parthasarathy,
Even yours is a tale, an important dirty tell though. WHy would a person tell others in his ears about the stuff of aryans coming to India ? Couldn't he tale a better route ?
is one of the reasons why Hindus keep fighting with each other.
They fight because everyone was made to understand a different fairy (dirty) tale, and the people involved are the ones like ministers, social scintists.... They were shown to be fighting all along, they are supposed to fight for devlopment. They may fight till extintion of hinduism.
You also say that Brahmins dont give as much importance to money as to the sacred scriptures. Perhaps!! But I can point to you a huge number of Brahmins, settled here in the US, including yours truly who have had no problem in choosing alien surroundings and to live amidst foreigners because their priority was not what you think it is.
Part of it is because of the independence generation that went in a different way, you don't have to go to US... Look for N Ram, RS Sharma, lot of communist Bengali Brahmins...Agree, you got an important issue here, and this is quite a victory for secularism.
I didnt even read P's comments
since I felt he wasnt worth my
attention.
Now that Virat0 has copied some
lines, I did read, from virat0. I
always read what Virat writes.
Dear P -
The brahmins I am talking of are
the ones who stayed Vedic. Not the
teeny minority who made their own
choices and are now BAD-mouthing
the Brahmin community, and WORSE
not even allowing others to say
anything good about the vedic
brahmins.
P thinks just because he and others
made their own present choices,
MY ancestors, and other such
people, many of whom have been
extremely sincere, deserve to be
maligned on dalit websites. And
Daisies should shut up, because P
does not fit her description of
brahmins.
_
Dear Dear P says:
"Brahmins reciting Vedic verses into their children's ears (lest a shudra nearby overheard it)."
I would like to see photographs of
this happening, and also proof that
this indeed was the intent of
those "wicked whispering Brahmins".
Dear P has grown up on a steady
diet of Max Mueller's and Witzel's
fairy tales.
Today he sits in USA filing patents
to protect his IP, so that no one
will steal his prosperity. He
doesnt want even to share his
economic properity and IP freely
with shudras.
On the other hand, the poor
vedic brahmins only protetcted the
Vedas from distortion, by their
very strict rules, Thank God for
that.
I also know that NO GURU will give
knowledge randomly without
systematic training. Why ? Because
1) distortion possibility.
2) A LITTLE KNOWLEDGE IS A
DANGEROUS THING !!! (half
knowledge can be worse than
no knowledge!!!)
Pranayama done improperly can give
spinal problems, headaches, what
not. This is just ONE example.
I wont waste any more time on P.
He doesnt deserve my time.
And anyway all he can understand
is modern programming languages
and chip design.
And is an EXPERT at selectively
abusing just one blogger, out of
this entire team of bloggers. Only
ONE blogger became his target of
abuse.
Shows me his deep INsincerity to
values.
And that too, he has never
contributed here, he only reads
posts, and he feels entitled to
complain about me and to preach
to me.
Even high-tech USA has
not taught him the importance of
value-added contributions. He is
just a whiner and complainer, with
only ONE target on the blog.
Hope he will learn to be a
positive contributor in future.
_
Daisies,
I agree with your second post from below about the reasons why you tried to defend Brahmins (surprise, surprise! we agree). But please tell me honestly. During India's rich history, have Brahmins really been the humble Veda chanting, alms seeking people that you claim they are? I doubt it. That is my main reason of disagreement. Just because there is a need for Hindus to feel united today doesnt mean we all have to sweep past problems under the carpet and try to convince each other that all is well. The right approach will be to ignore the troublemakers who practise the Semitic religions and deal with our own problems ourselves.
---"Even yours is a tale, an important dirty tell though. WHy would a person tell others in his ears about the stuff of aryans coming to India ? Couldn't he tale a better route ?"
I didnt understand. If you are saying that I believe in the Aryan Invasion/Migration theory, you are mistaken. Or if you think any of this is an introduction to convince you that reservations are the way to go, that is wrong too.
---"Part of it is because of the independence generation that went in a different way, you don't have to go to US... Look for N Ram, RS Sharma, lot of communist Bengali Brahmins...Agree, you got an important issue here, and this is quite a victory for secularism."
Perhaps so. But do you consider N Ram as a Hindu? I dont.
---"I also know that NO GURU will give
knowledge randomly without
systematic training. Why ? Because
1) distortion possibility.
2) A LITTLE KNOWLEDGE IS A
DANGEROUS THING !!! (half
knowledge can be worse than
no knowledge!!!)"
I wish those were the reasons. But this is why I say that you try tp paint a fairy tale picture. Things were not as glossy as you make them sound, Daisies. If I was harsh to you, my apoliogies. I didnt mean to irritate you. But if you really claim that you are well versed with our culture, why is it that you cannot accept the mistakes we did in the past and correct them for the future generations?
Daisies, ou assume that my career deals with programming languages and chip design. No, I am a finance consultant, just so you know.
Dear Dear P,
In my eyes, you are still a very
uncultured person, just beginning
to learn the ABC's of culture,
principles and values. In USA,
courtesy is highly valued. You
did not even have that to begin
with, when you wrote here from
there.
In India we say - "Vidya without
Vinayam is Vyartham" (Education
without humility is waste).
I am glad to see change in your
attitude and behaviour. But, one swallow does not make a summer.
So I decline to answer your
questions, because you are not yet
MERITORIOUS and DESERVING.
You have not earned my respect yet.
I wish you great growth. Maybe
someday, some other blogger will
answer your questions if he/she
finds in you a deserving candidate.
_
I didnt understand. If you are saying that I believe in the Aryan Invasion/Migration theory, you are mistaken. Or if you think any of this is an introduction to convince you that reservations are the way to go, that is wrong too.
Nope, none of the above are the reasons...However I thought you burrowed widely used description , and its uses too as it is used alongside a manufactured image. The reason was not to sweep past anything, but to express that may be another great image be sweeped away by that cover. May be hindus had a place in the grand universe rather than being manipulated by little conspiracies of history and something called a brahmin.
well virat,
If you say "something called a brahmin", then anyone can say
"something called a hindu".
they care 2 hoots about the
"greatness of hindus" and the
"grand place of hindus in the
universe", just like virat cares
2 hoots about the "thing" called
brahmin.
for the western historians,
hindu is just some stupid
insignificant "thing".
whereas 'aryan' has a grand place
in the universe.
_
If you say "something called a brahmin", then anyone can say
"something called a hindu".
Sometimes even this much is considered too much to grant politically.
just like virat cares
2 hoots about the "thing" called
brahmin.
I think 'thing' is what happened in secular analysis, they lost and settled for analyzing the objects . I pity such analysis and hope for better standards of govt paid analyssts. Considering such analysis is by the blind fellows, how many hoots would you or for that matter any sane person could care for ?
re:
"I think 'thing' is what happened in secular analysis, they lost and settled for analyzing the objects . I pity such analysis and hope for better standards of govt paid analyssts. Considering such analysis is by the blind fellows, how many hoots would you or for that matter any sane person could care for ?"
- Virat,
Your posts are mostly very hard
to understand, almost cryptic,
although I always read them and
try to decipher, because your
viewpoint seems very unique,
usually. Not that I always agree
with you, but it is unique.
I confess I could not understand
a thing in the above lines.
I tried my best.
Let me clarify my statement again
- if any entity within hinduism
is a "thing" for you, then Xists
M-ists and Witzels will all be
justified in calling hindus a
"thing".
This is a logical conclusion, and
I am surprised you are defending
yourself so much against a very
simple logical conclusion.
_
oh my god daisies, I am reminded of 2 ladies having a verbal duel across their compound wall in west mambalam.
:)
(madrasis will understand what I am talking about)
madrasi passer-by eavesdropper, :)
this isnt two ladies across a
compound wall in madras. :)
these are two highly intellectual
pundits with the greatest concern
for the nation's well-being.
:-)
Madrasi_gult : Say it to Jayalalitha, She would try you in chennai Tourism office :) Also Ensure your office is at a safe distance from west mamblam boundary walls.
Daisies, It was/is not a thing for me, but it exists already.
"I am glad to see change in your
attitude and behaviour. But, one swallow does not make a summer.
So I decline to answer your
questions, because you are not yet
MERITORIOUS and DESERVING."
Oh, I am so depressed and disappointed ever since I read this. I couldnt even sleep yesterday night. Daisies, please please answer my question. How could you do this to me? Please show some of that humility you just harped about. Do you remember my first post addressed to you? I mentioned that it was very easy to preach and very difficult to practise. You have just proved that in your posts ever since.
Dear Dear Dear Dear P,
You came here and abused me
starting from the first minute you
stepped into this blog. You kept
that up afterwards when you
revisited.
I have merely stated that in my
eyes, you are not yet meritorious
and deserving, because one
swallow does not make a summer.
SIMPLY BECAUSE you wrote me ONE
nice email after abusing me 20
times. That is why I said "One
swallow does not make a summer".
I was afraid you would have a
relapse.
You have shown me exactly that -
that you are NIT capable of more
than one nice email to someone
whom you sent 50 abusive posts,
starting from your entry here.
You just proved me right - one swallow does not make a summer.
Nice record. And you still seem
entitled to abuse me, after all
this.
Dont come back here and abuse me
again.
This blog doesnt need your abuses.
You are a pollutant here.
Good luck. I wish you great growth
again.
_
Prithviraj L. Parthasarathy may pretend to belong brahmin varna but his occupation (indicating his limited intelligence) suggests he belongs to shudra or perhaps vaishya varna.
To explain what is a brahmin, I would point to the example of the highly acclaimed mathematician Paul Erdos.
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